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Old 06-28-2007, 06:47 AM   #15
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carbon fiber is only going to get more expensive…much, much more expensive.
You don't think that the manufacturers could get some credits for sequestering carbon? Pretty permanent way to store it, you'd think that all those corporate brains could find some way to get a government benefit out of it.
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Old 06-28-2007, 08:30 AM   #16
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It is difficult to determine the nationality of a team these days. If a team is identified by its national affilliation, it should comprise nationals. That certainly is the case with cricket, swimming, track, boxing, skiing, and even with the millions of dollars spent on professional soccer transfers, players can still only represent their own country in a competition between nations.

It appears national identity in sailing is now down to a matter of where your corporate headquarters are sited, and that doesn't take into account the nationality of your majority shareholders. My opinion, right or wrong, is that if a sports team identifies itself as the team from a particular country, it should have only nationals of that country playing on the team.

As for rule changes.....If the 'home' team could not change the rules to suit their own requirements, the America's Cup would have been lost to America after the initial encounter with Sir Thomas Lipton.

But, despite the arguments for or against rules changes and team nationality, the high end of sailing technology and being able to choose your crews irrespective of nationality, allows for spectacularly talented sailing between craft which are perhaps 98%similar. If entertainment is the expected result, the rulemakers have it right. If national pride is the motivation, then the rulemakers have made a hash of it.

Gambatte

David
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Old 06-28-2007, 10:04 AM   #17
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You don't think that the manufacturers could get some credits for sequestering carbon? Pretty permanent way to store it, you'd think that all those corporate brains could find some way to get a government benefit out of it.
I could start an entirely new thread on the subject of carbon fiber, but to be brief...

Although there are alternative methods of producing carbon fiber, the high strength carbon fiber used by AC boats, aircraft, large scale wind energy and fuel cell automobiles, is manufactured from petroleum. It requires very large quantities of petroleum, as base constituent and to generate power for the process, to manufacture carbon fiber. As a result, the oil industry is a major investor in the growing carbon fiber industry. Many times more pounds of carbon dioxide are produced in the process of making carbon fiber than pounds of carbon fiber generated. I will find the exact figures if interested.

The present demand for carbon fiber greatly outstrips supply and is only getting worse as Boeing and Airbus transition from aluminum to carbon fiber for their airframes. Toray Carbon Fiber, a leading Japanese producer of carbon fiber, built an entire factory in the US just to supply Boeing’s needs for the next 5 years.

For those that think fuel cell vehicles are the answer to our future transportation needs, think again. In order to store gaseous hydrogen at 10,000 psi in large enough quantities to enable 400 miles driving range, it requires hundreds of pounds of carbon fiber to produce the onboard storage tanks…not to mention the tanks used at the filling station and the energy used to produce the hydrogen gas.

Oh yeah, those giant wind generators being built to reduce our dependency on oil, they require thousands of pounds of oil. Repaying their carbon footprint will take decades.

Nothing is as it seems…it would seem

Alinghi sailed a superb race 4.
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Old 06-28-2007, 11:22 AM   #18
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Alinghi sailed superbly to level the series, two all.

Interesting protest by the Kiwis.

It's anybody's Cup!

David.
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Old 06-28-2007, 02:57 PM   #19
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Sorry, sorry...my bad.

Yeah, what was the protest about? I heard something at the very end of the race in which the race officials wanted to see the mains dropped without the help of the man on the mast. Alinghi had a real difficult time getting it done.

I haven't heard anything else about it.
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Old 06-28-2007, 06:09 PM   #20
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Protest Dismissed Jun 28, 16:10

By a majority vote, not unanimous. No facts or basis for the decision were given orally. Written decision to come yet this evening. Measurement Committee have the right to conduct whatever subsequent checks they feel may be appropriate. No surprises.
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Old 06-29-2007, 07:10 PM   #21
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Race 5 to the Swiss, who now lead 3-2.

Didn't see the race (don't have cable TV) but looked it up on the net.

14 knot winds.

NZ won the start, but then had a spinnaker disaster on the first downwind leg.

Spinnaker developed a small tear, and then, as they were about to hoist a replacement, it burst.

2nd spinnaker was hoisted before being properly secured (communication breakdown?), so it just flew like a flag from the masthead.

They had to catch it to get the halyard, then hoisted a 3rd spinnaker.

During all this, Ahlingi overtook them.

Incredibly, despite all this disaster, the Kiwis were not that far behind, and started to catch up.

They launched a 4th spinnaker (symetrical this time) on the 2nd downwind leg.

Sounds very close racing.

Points for me:

* Even the best sailors can make mistakes - I shouldn't feel too bad when I do.

* These boats must carry an amazing number of sails? When the skipper was asked how many he had, he only said "Obviously just enough."

Rob
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Old 06-29-2007, 08:32 PM   #22
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* Even the best sailors can make mistakes - I shouldn't feel too bad when I do.
Best America's Cup racing ever IMHO!!!

Kiwis can absolutely win this one. Even with the worst spinnaker mishap I've ever witnessed, they almost came back.

They have the speed and talent to beat Alinghi.
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Old 06-29-2007, 09:49 PM   #23
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This is all great racing! When the Kiwis clagged the hoist of their replacement spinaker, I was shouting at the TV like some demented football fan. The series is alive and I agree with Trim, from the point of view of sailing and the spirit in which the teams are competing this is the greatest America's Cup ever...

(But there will never be anything like the time the Aussies booted the Seppos in 1983)

Anyone writing the script now, would have the Kiwis winning the next two races on the trot!

Sensational...

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Old 06-29-2007, 11:39 PM   #24
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the time the Aussies booted the Seppos in 1983)
The best thing that ever happened to AC racing!
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Old 06-30-2007, 02:47 PM   #25
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Another top race with Alinghi crossing the finish line 28 seconds before Emirates. Two thirds of the way along the second upwind leg, the Kiwis led. The Swiss simply out manoevered the Kiwis and sailed over the top of them to lead by 16 seconds at the mark leading into the final leg.

Alinghi now is on match point. If they win the next race they retain the Cup. If the Kiwis can take race seven, the series will be given new life.

Not a good day on the international sporting front for the Kiwis. The Wallabies defeated the All Blacks in the Rugby 20-15, after being down 15-6 at half time.

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Old 07-03-2007, 02:28 PM   #26
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Well, it's all over. The 32nd America's Cup will go down, in my opinion as the very best ever! A drama filled race which saw the Kiwis suffer a penalty turn which they executed within 100metres of the finish line. Alinghi won the final race, in boisterous conditions, by just two seconds.

Unbelievably good sailing and as much as I hate to say it, it was a better series than the 1983 regatta which saw the Aussies take the Cup from the USA. If you did not see the final race, do whatever you can to get to see it. WOW!!

Congratulations to Alinghi...Commiserations to the Kiwis.

Sensational!
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Old 07-03-2007, 09:07 PM   #27
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I'm gonna view it tonight on DVR. I feel badly for the Kiwis as they certainly gave it their all and I felt they were the better tactical team. Nonetheless, Alinghi demonstrated excellent overall tactics as well. In the end, everyone knows that the land(s) down under are out producing the rest of the world when it comes to sailing talent.

Cheers to ya Kiwis!
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Old 07-04-2007, 12:38 AM   #28
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Wow Wow and Wow! Best America's Cup race ever! You couldn't write a better story.
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