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Old 02-02-2007, 07:26 AM   #15
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I use the CQR as it was on the boat when I bought it. It has performed very well so far but I think the next will be a Bruce. I see plenty of Bruce's on the bigger boats here and they are relatively cheap compared to others. CQR's are quite spendy. I think the main thing is to carry at least two anchors of different design so the correct anchor can be used based on bottom consistency. RT
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Old 02-02-2007, 08:54 PM   #16
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Hi all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Converted Post
Originally posted by Nausikaa

With anchors it is horses for courses. Ideally you should have a specific anchor for each type of holding ground you will anchor in...but that would be in an ideal world. Anchors cost money, take up space and are heavy. IMHO the best solution is to have two or three different anchors.
This is now a false logic, as it relies on the assumption that anchors are specialist, intended for particular bottom. It happens that the old traditional types have characteristics that reinforce this idea. However, you end up carrying three or four different types, each for a particular purpose, each present only to address the flaws of the others. The result is only one effective anchor for any given scenario, and even that is never assured.

Much better to find a type that is truly general purpose, one which will set and hold in any bottom. Then carry several of that type, or similar designs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Converted Post
Originally posted by Francis

Thanks for the info on the Rocna, looks good. However the Spade sold by West Marine is significntly cheaper ... Perhaps I missed something in the process.
Perhaps you missed the "Prices are in New Zealand dollars" notice on the pricing page.

North American pricing is available from the respective resellers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Converted Post
Originally posted by rwthomas1

I use the CQR as it was on the boat when I bought it. It has performed very well so far but I think the next will be a Bruce. I see plenty of Bruce's on the bigger boats here and they are relatively cheap compared to others. CQR's are quite spendy. I think the main thing is to carry at least two anchors of different design so the correct anchor can be used based on bottom consistency.
A Bruce of the same size will never hold as well as a CQR; you must oversize the Bruce. Having said that, you will have fun trying to get a genuine Bruce now, since they are no longer produced. The only options available are copies, such as the Lewmar Claw which made a notable appearance (for all the wrong reasons) in the SAIL testing as depicted in the graph posted above by Spike_dawg (not that I would expect the Bruce to perform much better on hard sand).

The CQR is "spendy" because you get what you pay for (within reason).

Your last comment regarding multiple types is similar in fallacy to that of Nausikaa's.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:35 PM   #17
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Welcome aboard Craig - and thanks for the input.
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Old 02-03-2007, 06:09 AM   #18
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[QUOTE=Converted Post]Originally posted by Craig Smith

Quote:
Your last comment regarding multiple types is similar in fallacy to that of Nausikaa's.
Explain?

RT
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Old 02-03-2007, 05:06 PM   #19
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I am amazed to note Craig's comment in which he claims that I am wrong in that anchors of one type hold better on specific sea beds than of another. Thirty odd years at sea tells me I am right. However, in all fairness I must admit to never having tried a Rocna anchor and if the Rochna is as good as he claims then nobody will be happier than me. In fact, if the claim is justified then a Rocna will be my next anchor.

I see from the graph on the Rochna site that the anchor compares favourably with all others but without specifying the type of holding ground. Any details about this?

yours aye

Stephen

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Old 02-03-2007, 06:30 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by name='Converted Post'
Originally posted by Nausikaa

I see from the graph on the Rochna site that the anchor compares favourably with all others but without specifying the type of holding ground. Any details about this?
This is MOST important! I am surprised that this is not mentioned in the "test".
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Old 02-03-2007, 07:30 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by name='Converted Post'
Originally posted by Nausikaa

I am amazed to note Craig's comment in which he claims that am wrong in taht anchors of one type hold better o specific sea beds than of another. Thirty odd years at sea tells me I am right. However, in all fairness I must admit to never having tried a Rocna anchor and if the Rocna is as good as he claims then nobody will be happier than me. In fact, if the claim is justified then a Rocna will be my next anchor.
Quite - for our part, I will claim that the Rocna will set and out-perform any other anchor, on a size-for-size basis, regardless of the bottom type. One exception is rock, for which no anchor except perhaps a grapnel is effective. Anyway the point is it is a bit unnecessary to have a large range of types, e.g. CQR, Bruce, and Danforth, when the only reason is because you don't trust each on its own. Just find something better...

For example, and again I am dropping the Rocna name, so excuse me: Peter, our designer, is off across the Southern Ocean in a few months, single-handing his 50' 25 ton yacht, and is equipped with 4 Rocnas of various sizes - which he considers more than adequate for Patagonia, Antarctica, the north-east coast of South America, and then an intended trip across the pond to the Mediterranean. This is a guy who has a lifetime of experience with CQR, Bruce, Delta, Danforth, etc, and while you would expect him to be using his own design, it nonetheless provides some credibility - at least in my mind - considering the reliance placed on one's anchor(s).

Quote:
Originally Posted by name='Converted Post'
Originally posted by Nausikaa

I see from the graph on the Rocna site that the anchor compares favourably with all others but without specifying the type of holding ground. Any details about this?
Indeed the articles in question, from SAIL and Yachting Monthly, specify in some detail what the bottom type was. You will find both on our "independent reviews" page. For the record, it was three locations in California, all sand, more hard than soft.
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Old 02-03-2007, 08:27 PM   #22
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Here's a problem/question about bottom type.

Twice we have anchored in bays with bottoms that seemed to be thixotropic. I love that word, did not like what it is. Thixotropy - a seemingly thick substance that thins upon being agitated. Classic examples are Campbells Tomato Soup, catsup, and bentonite. Quicksand. If you fell into a vat of bentonite suspended in water (which is a clay), you would float unless you tried to swim. As soon as you tried to move the stuff would thin and you would sink.

Anchoring. The first place we encountered this peculiar bottom was in Curacao, I think Maundy's Bay, a very large and uninhabited bat at the very west end of the island. In Curacao and Aruba, famous for the Divi Divi trees that are permanently bent to leeward, the winds blow 20 to 30 knots all the time. The beaches are a very fine coral sand, a bit like talcum powder.

When we anchored in Maundy's bay with our CQR late in the day, the anchor seemed to hold just fine. All night long the wind howled above us keeping anchor rode taut. When we woke up the next morning we had dragged to the other side of the bay, yet the anchor was well set in the bottom. Wanting to stay another day or so, we got out our large Danforth anchor. And pulled it up, put it down, pulled it up, put it down everywhere in the bay. It just wouldn't hold. Back to the CQR. Same thing - it would initially hold, but then slowly, slowly we would be pushed back by the wind, anchor rode taut the entire time.

We wound up giving up and leaving.

The second and last time we encountered a bottom such as this was in French Polynesia, though I can't remember the island or bay. Again, we were the only boat there, it was a huge long bay, and we just dragged back almost the length of the bay. This time, however, we finally came to a stop and didn't move again.

Both times the anchor was down holding seemingly well, but backwards we would travel no matter what we tried.

Has anybody else had an experience such as this?
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Old 02-04-2007, 04:00 AM   #23
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Only time I dragged was in high winds with insufficient scope.

I have failed to anchor in only one place...Radio Bay, Hilo. Normally a great mud bottom with good holding, at times it packs down to almost like a sheet of rock.

The rocna anchor addresses the problem I have with the delta. It doesn't always set. The delta has good holding power but I find I must be very careful when deploying. If it doesn't set initially then all the dragging around in the world won't make it dig in. You have to lift it and redeploy or it just skips along the bottom. As mentioned before..the rocna will be my next anchor. It's just a better anchor.
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Old 02-04-2007, 12:43 PM   #24
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I have a Super Max and have been very happy with it. I beleiver that it is only sold in the States.
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Old 02-04-2007, 12:56 PM   #25
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Thanks for the information Graig.

I sincerely hope that all you claim the Rochna anchor is capable of is true as I am certainly prepaired to purchase one and try it. Next problem then. Where can I get hold of one? My boat is in Denmark.

Regards

Stephen

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Old 02-04-2007, 01:14 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by name='Converted Post'
Originally posted by Nausikaa

Thanks for the information Craig.

I sincerely hope that all you claim the Rocna anchor is capable of is true as I am certainly prepaired to purchase one and try it. Next problem then. Where can I get hold of one? My boat is in Denmark.
We are actually in the process of setting up a Danish distributor, but for the time being your closest agents are the Netherlands and the UK. See "where to buy" on our website for details (set region to Europe).
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Old 02-04-2007, 05:51 PM   #27
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quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by Francis

Thanks for the info on the Rocna, looks good. However the Spade sold by West Marine is significntly cheaper ... Perhaps I missed something in the process.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Perhaps you missed the "Prices are in New Zealand dollars" notice on the pricing page.

North American pricing is available from the respective resellers.

No I didn't miss the fact that the prices were in NZ$. However I did miss the fact that the currency converter did not work , it output the same value regardless of the currency. So indeed the Rocna is more competitive than the Spade from WM. Incidently Defender is more expensive.
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Old 02-05-2007, 01:33 AM   #28
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Thixotropic. That is a good word. Regarding getting an anchor to set in poor holding ground, like a "thixotropic" bottom, has anyone tried a tandem anchor setup? I never have, just read about it and wonder how well it works. Certainly makes sense at least in theory.....

Regarding the Rocna. Being constantly bombarded by advertising makes me leary of anyone that offers advice while having something to sell me. Not that the Rocna is flawed, it may in fact be a superior anchor. I believe the Rocna was tested by Practical Sailor in the last year or so? I notice that the PS test is not on your website? RT
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