Go Back   Cruiser Log World Cruising & Sailing Forums > Cruising Forums > General Cruising Forum
Cruiser Wiki Click Here to Login

Join Cruiser Log Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 01-26-2009, 10:32 PM   #21
Ensign
 
Ancoralatina's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 11
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nausikaa View Post
Ever seen a ship with a snubber?
Sorry, if I am wrong! I was thinking this was a forum about yachts, not about merchant ship!

If ship are not using snubbers, nearly all blue water cruisers who are anchoring with an all chain rode are using snubbers when the conditions deteriorate.

It is very easy, using the catenary formula, to determine when the last link of chain will no longer be lying on the sea bed, and using a normal scope (5:1) and the rightly sized chain, as I said before this will happen with about 25 to 30 knots of wind.

Then the chain will not make any more damping by catenary, and this is why, you should use a snubber.

For more detailed mathematical formulas, see: Tuning an anchor rode:alain.fraysse.free.fr/sail/rode/rode.htm
__________________

__________________
Joo Nodari

ANCORA LATINA
Ancoralatina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2009, 10:42 PM   #22
Ensign
 
Ancoralatina's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 11
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbopeep View Post
Yes, I like good "old" technology that works Just because something is "modern" doesn't make it better... than 80 year old or thousands of years old technology. Only the advertisers and marketing folks will have you believe that!
As I tell my kids often "don't slag something until you've tried it".

Is that a relevant statement here?? I suspect it maybe.

If I may ask ? What is your experience comparing old generation of anchors with new tech ??
__________________

__________________
Joo Nodari

ANCORA LATINA
Ancoralatina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 02:04 AM   #23
Moderator
 
JeanneP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,098
Default

Lynger1, now see what you've done. *You've started an*anchor thread, that much maligned, usually dreaded chain of arguing on, and on, and on about what is the best anchor, whose tests are valid, etc., etc.

My turn again to offer opinions, though I'm using others' experience as much as our own.

We have an old "advanced cruiser" friend whose home-built steel boat was his home in the Caribbean for many years. *He was a solo sailor, and would sail 50+ miles from St. Martin to Nevis just to buy 50 pounds of inexpensive sugar (there's another story here, but not for this thread). *He did not head to Venezuela for hurricane season, and safely rode out many tropical storms and hurricanes at anchor in his boat, including Luis and Hugo, two very destructive storms in the Carib. *

He had two techniques that worked exceptionally well for him.

His was a typical hard-chined home-built steel sloop, and because it liked to sail at anchor, in high winds he anchored from the stern, which stopped the sailing on the anchor. *His second technique was the tandem anchoring technique, and he swore by it, never having dragged in all the storms he'd been through. *During HUGO he jumped off his boat and swam to where another solo sailor had grounded his boat after he had lost all five (5)! of his anchors. *He helped the fellow secure the boat to the mangroves so it wouldn't be refloated and pushed into other boats anchored in the lagoon, then swam back to his boat (high winds but little fetch where he was anchored) which calmly waited for his return.

Another sailor who, after many troubles anchoring in Patagonia and Antarctica, found the tandem anchoring technique to be effective, was Gerry Smith who wrote about his Antarctic adventures in his book "THE TOTORORE VOYAGE". *In my opinion, a great read. *The engine on his boat seemed to fail to start when he really needed it, so secure anchoring was something he really needed.

Snubber. *We made a mistake and anchored too close to a reef protecting a beach in Fiji. *An unexpected storm caught a lot of boats facing violent winds and praying that their anchor would hold as the wind shift during the storm turned us around and put us all on a lee shore. *Peter is sure that it was the two snubbers on our all-chain anchor rode that kept the chain from breaking, or our bow rollers from shattering under the violent stresses of the winds and waves. *One of the two snubbers broke and Peter had to ride the bucking bow while he rigged a new snubber. *We got through that storm safely, and we are sure that the snubbers are what saved the ground tackle from failing as the result of shock loads.

I don't doubt that different boats will have different successful techniques for safely anchoring, and I am interested in hearing about them. * Let's not, though, toss out that which is old and tried and true because it's old-fashioned. *Show me a proven better anchor, gear, technique and spare me the "get with it, move into the 21st Century!"

Fair winds and calm anchorages,

Jeanne
__________________
In 1986 we went cruising for a few years. After 20 years and 50+ countries and several oceans, we are STILL "cruising for a few years".

SY WATERMELON |
MV WATERMELON (New) | Cruiser's Dictionary, free ebook

= Cruiser's Dictionary, North America,
JeanneP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 05:38 AM   #24
Admiral
 
Nausikaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,619
Default

Quote:
Sorry, if I am wrong! I was thinking this was a forum about yachts, not about merchant ship!

If ship are not using snubbers, nearly all blue water cruisers who are anchoring with an all chain rode are using snubbers when the conditions deteriorate.
You are right. This is a forum about cruising yachts. However, just because w are cruising orientated does not mean that we should be blind for good practices found elsewhere.

My whole point in the comparison with merchant ships us the they have been anchoring far longer than yachts and, being much bigger the forced are greater yet they use relatively small anchors and cable - just lots of it!

If a yacht used the equivalent length of cable then she would ride much easier, the weight of the cable itself providing the cushioning action. Agreed that the snubber offers the paintwork more protection and, if they offer a smoother time at anchor, I have nothing against them (and use them myself)assuming that an adequate length of cable is deployed. The risk with a snubber is that some, because they are getting an easier ride, may be tempted to have too little scope of cable out.

I too am of the opinion that what is old and proven should not be tossed out just because something new is on the market.

Aye // Stephen
__________________
Yacht NAUSIKAA | Call Sign: 2AJH2




WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU DID SOMETHING FOR THE FIRST TIME?

www.nausikaa.org.uk

= Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Lithuania
Nausikaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 10:44 AM   #25
Admiral
 
MMNETSEA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,067
Default

Thanks to the author of this topic - it has illustrated the amount of experience that has gone into securing the cruising yacht - built on the history of former sailing ships - merchants vessels - and the experience of local sailors and fishermen in far flung lands.

Having used small tyres as snubbers when the tackle catenary was at full stretch - they do something for peace of mind.

Here is a site that provides a little light on the subject of the catenary :- CLICK
__________________
MMNETSEA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 04:48 PM   #26
Rear Admiral
 
Aquaria's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Home Port: Hamburg
Vessel Name: Aquaria
Posts: 278
Default

... this is indeed an interesting and informative thread! There is alot to read about anchoring techniques.

But I start wondering, why I never had the idea or felt the need of bringing out more than one anchor.

Reflecting on the hundreds of situations of laying at anchor (Baltis Sea, Portugal, Spain, Caribbean) I simply found it not practical to put out more than one anchor:

- carrying an oversized anchor with 50 Meters of 8mm chain on my 5ton boat creates alot of safety.

- what a hastle to bring out two anchors and what happens if the wind shifts?

- what about angry neighbours on an anchorage if some boats chose to use two anchors and others didn't... and then the wind shifts?

- in a deteriorating situation nothing is easier to get out just one hook and leave for a safer place.

- good seamanship is keeping an anchor watch all the time your boat is at anchor - i.e. not leaving the boat over a longer period of time,

and if, just under stable weather conditions and maybe telling the neighbouring yacht (you can trust) to keep an eye on your boat.

- always using a marina when we planned to leave the boat over night or longer.

- even bow or stern to a tree or rock (done more often in the Baltic, as Stephen already described) can be risky: just imagine your anchor just slipping a little... your bow hits the rock. And this can happen faster then one can imagine. It happened to us in Norway, tied up to a rock, anchor out astern and a gentle breeze started in the afternoon from abeam... We were just gone for half an hour, the anchor slipped and we were so happy that we had some nice Norwegian neighbours who realized the situation.... Since then we prefer anchoring free, giving the anchor a chance to dig back in again in case it should come free. Enough room leewards is of corse necessary to decide in time if one should better leave. And this even in Sweden and Norway, where anchoring irritatingly close bow to the rocks is nearly standard.

SY Aquaria

Uwe

__________________
If you have the time, you alwas have the right winds.

More on my Centurion 32:
http://www.cabinetdeparodontologie.n...ria/index.html
I've Contributed to the Cruisers Wiki: Germany, Background, Cruising/Sailing the German Bight
Aquaria is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 05:15 PM   #27
Admiral
 
Nausikaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,619
Default

Well said Uwe. I could not agree more.

Good seamanship is, I believe, represented by the acronym MCS - Mostly Common Sense.

Uwe's post is the zenith of common sense.

But that is just my opinion of course although I think most will agree.

Aye // Stephen
__________________
Yacht NAUSIKAA | Call Sign: 2AJH2




WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU DID SOMETHING FOR THE FIRST TIME?

www.nausikaa.org.uk

= Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Lithuania
Nausikaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 08:21 PM   #28
Moderator
 
redbopeep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeanneP View Post
Lynger1, now see what you've done. You've started an anchor thread, that much maligned, usually dreaded chain of arguing on, and on, and on about what is the best anchor, whose tests are valid, etc., etc.

Jeanne
Thanks! Jeanne for giving us your experiences and for pointing us back to our original goal here--which is to support Lynger1 in his desire to safely anchor

We all have what we have in terms of ground tackle and learning how to use it to best advantage is the goal! Seldom do cruisers have the luxury of going out and buying new anchors--though extending the amount of chain one owns is always a goal.

Good luck to Lynger1 in his quest for the best anchoring given his situation.
__________________
"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda

What we're doing - The sailing life aboard and the Schooner Chandlery.

redbopeep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2009, 11:44 PM   #29
Commander
 
Frank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Home Port: Puerto Montt
Vessel Name: Westerly Serenade
Posts: 115
Default

Wow...an anchor thread... I hope I'm not to late...some of my thoughts about the points raised.

Big ships.... I think anchoring in big ships is a totally different deal.... very much down to weight of the chain... cable stretched right out? Walk back until the catenary comes back...all chain out and still stretched bar tight?... ease the strain with the main engine. And yes they do use 'snubbers' of a sort. Cable compressors in front of the windlass take the load of the windlass.

I have used tandem anchoring on big ships..... drill ships... lying to an array of 8 anchors.. four up the front...four down the back... if an anchor won't set and keeps coming home just get e work boat to hang another anchor off the end and another and another until it does set or you run out of anchors. Note here that the 'pull' on that tandemised group of anchors is in the one constant direction.

Small boats. I know a few in Chile who use tandem anchors...without exception their primary anchor and chain is undersized and so they tandem with another undersized anchor . Reports suggest that it works but don't forget that they are invariably lying to anchor(s) plus 2 or more shore lines and the wind blowing out of the anchorage over their stern.

If you lay out anchors in tandem and are free to swing then whenever the wind backs or veers you are back to lying to a single anchor.

My boat ( 39 foot, 8.5 tonnes dry) came from the builders with a 45 lb( say 20 kg) CQR and 70 metres of 8mm chain. I would dearly love to have more or heavier chain ( or both ) but no way will that fit in the chain locker so I live with what I have. My CQR served me well for many years but in the end not only was it physically worn out it was also giving me all sorts of grief... failing to set in Chile time after time in kelp and on rocky bottom. So I gave it the flick. I don't think there is such a thing as a perfect anchor for all conditions, CQRs are IMO a mud anchor, you would go broke trying to sell them in South Australia for example where hard sand bottoms see the Swarbrick and other fisherman types very popular.

Moving right along...decided to go with a Rocna having had good reports from boats in Chile with them. I went up a size to 25kg... 20 is what they suggest for a boat of WS's length and weight in normal use. Now that isn't to suggest that the anchor doesn't work, just that I can handle the extra weight and blade area so I would be a mug not to take it. Since fitting it and using it in some 50 anchorages it has set first time every time so seems to be a suitable anchor for my application.

I use a nylon snubber but don't see it as replacing catenary or such... it will absorb shock loadings and as far as I am concerned it is there to take these loadings off the windlass. Once again... chain stretched right out ? pay out more chain....run out of chain? Then I can attach 100 metres or so of nylon rode to the bitter end. That is also handy in deep anchorages. Cray boats working the west coast of Tasmania anchor out on the 100 fathom line using nothing more than pot line as a rode ....

Thats it..

Well not quite... edited to add..

To stop a boat sailing around her anchor etc you can always put a bit of sail up down the back... them as has a yawl can do it with the mizzen... failing that just hang something off your backstay or topping lift or wherever. One of the biggest culprits on boats that won't lay head to wind is the windage created by the furled jib.
__________________
= Chile,
I've Contributed to the Cruisers Wiki: Chile
Frank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2009, 01:19 PM   #30
Commander
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Home Port: Stockton, MO
Vessel Name: Ceilidh
Posts: 160
Default

Not offering an opinion, but it seems someone is touting "new" anchoring technology, and then disclaiming linking anchors together... Rocna (new technology) has a hole in the shank cited in their literature for the purpose of attaching a second anchor!

Sorry, I just had to point this out.

I have recently purchased both an original Rocna and the Manson Supreme (an alledged copy) in identical weights and plan some tests this Spring to see if the financial difference in the Rocna is worth it. I am skeptical as to the "Rock Slot" in the Manson, but will test it also before offering an opinion. I use a riding sail off of the back stay to reduce my boats sailing at anchor.

We've been off in the Florida Keys for some time, missed you folks!

David and Brenda

s/v Friendship & s/v Ceilidh
__________________
Wildernesstech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2009, 01:48 PM   #31
Admiral
 
Nausikaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,619
Default

Good luck with the anchor tests!

Do let us know how things turn out.

There is no doubt about it but ground tackle is a much maligned and, perhaps, little understood part of sailing. Most of us would rather fork out for a new plotter than new anchor and cable (chain). It is a shame because your anchors are one of the most important safety features on board.

New technology in this field will hopefully imptove safety but I would not throw out the old just because some new piece of kit comes on the market accompanied by fanfares and claims that it will be the universal panacea to all anchoring maladies. The bottom line, until proven otherwise, is added weight gives added security.

Aye // Stephen
__________________
Yacht NAUSIKAA | Call Sign: 2AJH2




WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU DID SOMETHING FOR THE FIRST TIME?

www.nausikaa.org.uk

= Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Lithuania
Nausikaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2009, 07:05 PM   #32
Commander
 
Frank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Home Port: Puerto Montt
Vessel Name: Westerly Serenade
Posts: 115
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wildernesstech View Post
Not offering an opinion, but it seems someone is touting "new" anchoring technology, and then disclaiming linking anchors together... Rocna (new technology) has a hole in the shank cited in their literature for the purpose of attaching a second anchor!

Sorry, I just had to point this out.

David and Brenda

s/v Friendship & s/v Ceilidh
Not touting new technology at all...my CQR was well past its use by date.... the 'plough' was almost paperthin in places ... and it was creaking at its joint. I went for a newer type of anchor cos I knew the CQR was not doing its job for much of the time. Chose the Rocna as boats in my waters were using them with good results. Its my primary anchor, my secondary is a Swarbrick, my kedge is a danforth, I have a Fortress just in case I ever need to row out an anchor, and I have a 'never been used' Manson CQR knockoff under my bunk which I think I may sell.

Yes , my Rocna has two holes and yes one is for use if people choose to go tandem... I use the other one, not for an anchor buoy but for securing it on the stemhead.

Stephen has it pegged when he says weight is security .
__________________
= Chile,
I've Contributed to the Cruisers Wiki: Chile
Frank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2009, 07:49 PM   #33
Moderator
 
redbopeep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank View Post
Stephen has it pegged when he says weight is security .
This is very true. Past experience in 25 to 45 ft boats have shown both my husband and I that a weighty all-chain rode and a "bigger than you think you need" anchor will work wonders.

In our case, on the 54' 29 Ton boat we're presently rebuilding for cruising, all our anchors are huge--95 lb, 105 lb, 120 lb...of Danforth, CQR, and Fisherman style respectively. We've got more chain than anyone I know (600 ft continuous of 1/2" BB.

Now, thinking of "new, shiny anchors to have..." I'd absolutely love to get out there on this boat with a brand new Spade, myself. I've heard wonderful things about the Spade from someone who has a boat of almost identical LOA, LWL, Displacement, Beam to our boat...they have even the same engine and windlass we have Their boat is steel, ours is wood...but considering that it would be roughly $2,100 to get the SPADE I'd like...well that just isn't gonna happen for a while...especially when I know the combo of 105 lb CQR and 120 lb Fisherman have been keeping this boat safe for its previous owners for...well...decades Hey, about as long as those CQR's have been out there, as a matter of fact. The boat was originally built in 1931 and cruised extensively in the 30's, 50's, 60's, and 70's by various folks. We know that our 120 lb fisherman is the original one the boat sailed with way back then and she used the anchor in Maine, Labrador and higher latitudes as well as in the Caribbean and Pacific Northwest. A CQR showed up on the scene in the 1950's though its probably not the one we have now. Both these anchors have been re-galvanized and kept up nicely, btw.

Interestingly enough, the most recent anchor--a 95 lb Danforth anchor is pretty much all the most recent owner before us ever used here in Southern California. He did not use the CQR nor the fisherman.

Depending on where one goes, it is nice to have big anchors of all the variety that may be useful. Rather than just buying a new anchor that we hope will work better...knowing different ways of how and when to use the ground tackle that one already has is also a good thing for all of us.

Onto "little anchors" now....though I'm strong for a woman, I find it hard to haul around any anchor much over 50 lbs. I literally have to drag our anchors around when moving them--I can't lift them. Its a joke to say I can move that 120 lb fisherman. I push on it, I shove on it, I kick it...get a running start and drag, drag, drag it Whatever is on the bow roller will end up being what we use if my husband isn't able to assist in changing out the anchor when needed.

Regarding anchor size, right now, we'd be hard pressed to kedge given the combination of big anchors and little bitty RIB we've got . As such, I've been on the lookout for a 37 lb Fortress and/or an aluminum Spade in the mid-30 lb range. I can see myself and the RIB both! being able to "handle" this as a kedge anchor.
__________________
"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda

What we're doing - The sailing life aboard and the Schooner Chandlery.

redbopeep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2009, 08:06 PM   #34
Commander
 
Frank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Home Port: Puerto Montt
Vessel Name: Westerly Serenade
Posts: 115
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbopeep View Post
all our anchors are huge--95 lb, 105 lb, 120 lb...of Danforth, CQR, and Fisherman style respectively. We've got more chain than anyone I know (600 ft continuous of 1/2" BB.
Cor!!!!! That's some serious kit!

I only know of 2 boats getting into serious trouble ( ie the incidents got on the Net and the boats ended up on the hard having major work done ) in Chile in my time. I have no idea what anchors they were using but would suggest that it was more a people problem than a gear problem...

You see all sorts of boats in the channels with all sorts of anchors and they all seem to work.... guess you just have to dance with the one you brung.
__________________
= Chile,
I've Contributed to the Cruisers Wiki: Chile
Frank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2009, 10:08 AM   #35
Ensign
 
Ancoralatina's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 11
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nausikaa View Post
The bottom line, until proven otherwise, is added weight gives added security.

Aye // Stephen
Again a very classical perceived wisdom

Except for a concrete block of mooring, holding is not related to WEIGHT, but to the surface area of the anchor, or to be more precise to the surface area of the flukes (blades).

This is clearly demonstrated by comparing the Danforth and the Fortress. For about the same anchor weight, the surface area of the Fortress is nearly three times the one of the Danforth, and the Fortress has a reputation of an high holding anchor...

Unfortunately, efficient fluke surface area is never given for the antic generation of anchors (Fisherman CQR...)

At least, it is interesting to compare the blade surface area of the new generation ones...

A 30 kg Spade has a surface area of 1400 sq cm

A 30 kg ROCNA has a surface area of 1590 sq cm

The Supreme is about the same surface area.

A 30 kg RAYA has a surface area of 2000 sq cm

To achieve the same surface area with a Fisherman anchor, you should at least use a 120 kg one!!!

Now it's a question of choice, if you like to have a lot of weight on the bow of your boat, the fisherman anchor would be a good choice.

If you want safety and to save both your back and money, go to the new gen ! For the same efficiency of a 30 kg Spade, you only need an 18 kg RAYA... much lighter and much cheaper!
__________________
Joo Nodari

ANCORA LATINA
Ancoralatina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2009, 10:14 AM   #36
Ensign
 
Ancoralatina's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 11
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wildernesstech View Post
Not offering an opinion, but it seems someone is touting "new" anchoring technology, and then disclaiming linking anchors together... Rocna (new technology) has a hole in the shank cited in their literature for the purpose of attaching a second anchor!

Sorry, I just had to point this out.

David and Brenda

s/v Friendship & s/v Ceilidh
Don't be sorry!

If you look at the RAYA Anchor, it has also a huge hole at the base of the shank for attaching either a trip line or a second anchor!

But this doesn't mean that "tandem set" technique is efficient!!!
__________________
Joo Nodari

ANCORA LATINA
Ancoralatina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2009, 07:00 PM   #37
Admiral
 
Nausikaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,619
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ancoralatina View Post
Again a very classical perceived wisdom
Are you honestly trying to tell me that two anchors of the same type hold equally well irrespective of weight?

Anchors are not just lumps of metal. There are better and worse anchor designs but even going for the best I would use the heaviest I could handle with chain.

Let's just have a look at a few examples of modern anchors:

FORTRESS

Fortress claim to be "The World's Best Anchor" (http://www.fortressanchors.com/)

They also claim to be certified by DNV but. lo and behold, their certificate expired last year (http://www.fortressanchors.com/dnv.html)

Their ABS certification also expired last year (http://www.fortressanchors.com/image...ingAss_big.jpg)

One would think the makers of "The World's Best Anchors) would have up-to-date certification for their product.

RAYA

From your website, I note that the claim is made that your anchor, the RAYA, has been tested in "independent tests carried out by the specialised nautical reviews" (http://www.ancoralatina.com/acolhime...sts/tests.html) although no reference is made to which tests nor to which body carried out the tests.

There is no indication of any classification society having tested the anchor.

I am not claiming the RAYA to be an inferior anchor. I would just like more than anecdotal evidence before changing my opinion.

DANFORTH

Danforth claim to be "The World's Most Trusted Anchor". OK, it is not the best as we all know by now that Fortress is the best but it is the "most trusted". I find that strange. I would rather put my trust in the best - but there again, that is just my own conviction.

Danforth offer a free lifetime warranty. Of course, your life may be short if blown onto a lee shore because the anchor did not hold. Oh, wait a moment; they mean "warranted to be free from manufacturing and material defects for the life of the product". (http://www.danforthanchors.com/dpdf/546.pdf). Well, if the product has failed due to material defect then it could be said that its lifetime had ended.

I was a bit flippant there because I know Danforth to be a serious company but they do not claim on their website to have been certified by a classification society. It is highly likely that they have been though as their products have been used on commercial applications.

BRUCE

Bruce anchors are no longer produced for the "leisure market". Shame. They were a little difficult to stow but worked well.

ROCNA

According to Rocna anchors, their anchors outperform even the Fortress (http://www.rocna.com/main.php?sectio...testing&page=0 ) but wait a minute, wasn't the Fortress the best on the world? Am I the only once confused here?

Rocna anchors have been the subject of many tests in boating magasines but I found no information on their website of official approval by a classification society.

CQR

Ah, the much maligned CQR. We could start another thread just asking what CQR means - there seem to be many variations of the meaning of the acronym but that will have to be kept for later.

The CQR is, wait for it, approved by LLoyds Register of Shipping as a High Holding Power anchor! Wow. Only the second anchor so far to have been approved by a recognised institution. (http://en.lewmar.com/products/index....g=1&page_id=12)

CLAW

The humble claw anchor (a copy of the Bruce) does not seem to have very much going for it. I found no certification or other tests but its brother the Bruce is used to hold oil rigs in place when winter storms lash the North and Norwegian Seas. One would think it could stop a small yacht from running away during the night when all are safely (?) tucked up below.

What are we left with? AH yes, the SPADE

Nice little anchor this. You can get it in polished stainless steel. That should help its holding powers, impress demersal living organisms and you could always use it as a mirror when you need to shave three weeks growth of beard off after having crossed the "pond".

On a more serious note, even the SPADE seems to lack official approval. The manufacturers however tell us that the anchor launched "a new era in anchoring technology" and that the SPADE is "the World's most reliable anchor" ( http://www.spade-anchor.co.uk/index.htm )

Now my confusion is almost boundless. The world's most reliable anchor is, apparently, not the world's best anchor and that is not the best performing anchor but non of the previous were the world's most trusted anchor. But there is no clarity in sight as another contender enters the ring. In the blue corner from New Zealand we have.......

THE MANSON SUPREME

Delving into the depths of the Manson website we find that this anchor has LLoyds approval and is "the very first anchor internationally to receive Super High Holding Power approval for pleasure boat anchors". ( http://www.manson-marine.co.nz/SitePages/SupLloyds.htm ) Now that must be good news! But wait a minute, didn't the Fortress have the same classification although from a Norwegian rather than British classification society? Yes it did so the SUPREME is not the first to achieve this status. It may well have been the first to reach that status with LLoyds but it wasn't the first in the world.

THE JUNGLE

Got you there - the JUNGLE is not an anchor. Did you think it was? No, the jungle is the place where anchor manufacturers are trying to sell their wares, each claiming to be the best, most reliable, shiniest or whatever superlative you can think of. Is it any wonder that the honest and simple sailor is confused? What we need is not a trained sales pitch. We need hard facts, independently corroborated. We need to know which anchor is best in different conditions.

I have enjoyed this little sojourn into the depths (pun fully intended) of the anchor world but I can not say that I am very much the wiser after it. This is due to the conflicting claims made by anchor manufacturers. It also means that I am treating every claim about the RAYA as sceptically as those made by the other manufacturers -although I have to admit, a certification from LLoyds, ABS or DNV goes a long way to calming my nerves and probably those of my insurers as well.

Aye // Stephen
__________________
Yacht NAUSIKAA | Call Sign: 2AJH2




WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU DID SOMETHING FOR THE FIRST TIME?

www.nausikaa.org.uk

= Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Lithuania
Nausikaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2009, 07:57 PM   #38
Retired Mod
 
Lighthouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Home Port: Durban
Posts: 2,984
Default

__________________


The World Cruising & Sailing Wiki

Help to build this free, online World Cruising Guide.

"Built by cruisers, for cruisers''

I've Contributed to the Cruisers Wiki: Most sections
Lighthouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2009, 10:53 PM   #39
Moderator
 
redbopeep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
Exclamation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nausikaa View Post
What are we left with? AH yes, the SPADE

Nice little anchor this. You can get it in polished stainless steel. That should help its holding powers, impress demersal living organisms and you could always use it as a mirror when you need to shave three weeks growth of beard off after having crossed the "pond".

Aye // Stephen
Oh, thank you Stephen...you've given me every reason now to have a little Spade as my kedge anchor--I can look into its shiny surface to make sure I look good while kedging!
__________________
"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda

What we're doing - The sailing life aboard and the Schooner Chandlery.

redbopeep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2009, 02:19 AM   #40
Commander
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Home Port: Darwin
Vessel Name: Gone Troppo
Posts: 103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ancoralatina View Post
Don't be sorry!

If you look at the RAYA Anchor, it has also a huge hole at the base of the shank for attaching either a trip line or a second anchor!

But this doesn't mean that "tandem set" technique is efficient!!!
Hi,

Surely you would not connect a second anchor to the base of the first anchors shank(trip line hole). This leads to the first anchor rolling when the boat swings, and may interfere with it resetting. Much better to connect the second anchor to the rode about a metre in front of the first anchor.

Interesting posts and good reading.

Regards,

Stephen
__________________

__________________
Happy Sailing,

Stephen

Crowther Windspeed 36

www.gonetroppo.org
GoneTroppo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
anchor


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Check Regime When Anchoring In Storm? magwas General Cruising Forum 24 12-01-2012 10:00 PM
Other People And Their Anchoring redbopeep General Cruising Forum 12 08-24-2010 06:10 PM
How To Learn Anchoring? magwas General Cruising Forum 11 08-10-2010 08:30 AM
River Anchoring redbopeep General Cruising Forum 2 06-27-2010 11:46 AM
Anchoring teejay Other Equipment 2 07-04-2009 07:59 PM

Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

RV & Travel Trailer Communities

Our RV & Travel Trailer sites encompasses virtually all types of Recreational Vehicles, from brand-specific to general RV communities.

» More about our RV Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


All times are GMT. The time now is 02:17 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0
×