Go Back   Cruiser Log World Cruising & Sailing Forums > Cruising Forums > General Cruising Forum
Cruiser Wiki Click Here to Login

Join Cruiser Log Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 09-13-2019, 08:36 AM   #1
Ensign
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Home Port: Fremantle
Posts: 1
Default Can we make anchoring safer?

Are a lot of yachtsmen too casual about anchoring? What can we do to be more secure at anchor?

Please watch the short video, I’m trying to encourage people to take anchoring more seriously, and be safer in strong winds.

https://youtu.be/FOKVO3JBgDY

Too many yachts drag because they use small, old-style anchors, which are often sized for ‘normal’ conditions, so they drag when the wind picks up. The new generation anchors are much more secure.

Traditional scope calculations are also a problem, they are based on rope rodes which are straight, rather than the chain which hangs in a curve.

I use 15m (50ft) plus double the depth, plus an extra 10m (30ft) in strong conditions. The starting length allows for the chain next to the anchor, which is flatter, and the double depth matches the chain at the top, where it is more vertical.
__________________

__________________
RichMac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2019, 12:59 PM   #2
Ensign
 
Seasick Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Home Port: Southampton
Vessel Name: Tyro
Posts: 22
Default

A lot depends on the conditions.

If I'm stopping for lunch in a sheltered creek in good weather with a metre under the keel (2m of water) I'll veer only the minimum 6m of cable. Overnight I use a minumum of 10 - 15m (still in 2 - 3m of water) and more if it's windy. But then I have a boat that can take the ground easily and don't (usually) mind waiting for the tide to lift me off.

I have a Westerly Centaur displacing about 3.5t, a 16lb Danforth (which is great for mud but not really big enough) and 37m of 8mm chain.

Haven't yet had to do it anywhere too exposed...
__________________

__________________
Seasick Steve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2019, 10:53 PM   #3
Admiral
 
Auzzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Home Port: Darwin
Vessel Name: Sandettie
Posts: 1,917
Default

Anchoring for lunch is one thing, and double the depth in a light breeze and slack tide is probably sufficient. However, I still abide by the old maxim of seven times the depth of water. While rope can always be added, I have 300' of chain and rarely anchor in over 40' of water.

Indeed the only times I can remember anchoring in deeper water has been recent trips to Vancouver Island and the San Juans where the bow may be in 80' while the stern is in 20'...I all cases it has been necessary to drop anchor, then take a stern line ashore.

Only once can I remember dragging the anchor seriously. Behind a small cay in The Bahamas, in 15' of water, the wind picked up to 25 knots during the night. The telltale growl of the chain over the bow roller told me to get out of bed. A quick reccy with the spotlight gave me that awful 'Oh- S**t' moment as the stern of our 50' sloop moved ever closer to oyster rocks.

Every now and again this sort of experience is valuable. It reminds me that even with decades of practical experience under my belt, I am still as capable as the next person of getting it wrong. What I did that was incorrect was allowing myself to anchor with much less than 100' of chain because the boats nearby had done the same, and I was concerned that swinging with the tide could have caused a subsequent problem. I should have moved further afield, dropped 100' of chain, dug it in and slept with a clear mind.

The three other boats in the anchorage were two small yachts of less than 30' and a powerboat of probably 40'. Only us and the powerboat had holding problems.
__________________
"if at first you don't succeed....Redefine success"!


Auzzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 03:43 PM   #4
Ensign
 
Seasick Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Home Port: Southampton
Vessel Name: Tyro
Posts: 22
Default

It's certainly true that the chain does more good on the bottom than it does in the locker, but when it comes to heaving it all back in again... Of course if you have a powerful windlass or capstan and don't mind making lots of noise and using the power, it's a lot easier! For those of us relying on Armstrong's patent it's hard work.
__________________
Seasick Steve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2019, 03:07 AM   #5
Admiral
 
Auzzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Home Port: Darwin
Vessel Name: Sandettie
Posts: 1,917
Default

Many years past, I put together a 36'er. I couldn't afford a windlass. I was anchored off Wagait beach in northern Australia and the wind shifted. All of a sudden, I was on a lee shore in 15 to 20 knots of wind as a squall line materialised over the horizon.

I was a very fit 35 year old with a healthy dose of fright. The trouble I had getting the hook off the bottom; then getting the boat into deeper water was a task I didn't want to repeat...also I was single handed.

I toured the salvage shops over the following 12 months, and managed to pick up a lightly used, though quite old, Admiral Benbow (?) windlass at a bargain price. It was still hard work, but using one hand at a time and 4 strokes per foot, it made it far easier for me to let out much more chain, in the knowledge that I could retrieve it with a degree of confidence.

It was an upright, bronze affair with greased bushes rather than bearings and was really a beautiful thing. It went well with the sextant, RDF, ancient electric depth sounder and my pride and joy; a second hand Kodan 8121 HF radio transceiver.

Gad, I hate getting old...
__________________
"if at first you don't succeed....Redefine success"!


Auzzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2019, 12:25 PM   #6
Ensign
 
Seasick Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Home Port: Southampton
Vessel Name: Tyro
Posts: 22
Default

Me too - but it's, arguably, better than the alternative.


The other problem (apart, that is, from environmental and financial implications) is that there's nowhere to put it. The foredeck in a Centaur is small - and will be smaller still when I get round to fitting the secondary cleats - and underneath it is my bed. And the extra battery and/or heavy wiring it'd need. And my disinclination to make major modifications to the boat. A lever-operated windlass is a possibliity I suppose - buy oh! so slow.

I suspect that when I get too old to heave in the cable by hand I shall either pack up entirely or buy a bigger boat.
__________________
Seasick Steve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2019, 02:45 PM   #7
Admiral
 
Auzzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Home Port: Darwin
Vessel Name: Sandettie
Posts: 1,917
Default

For years I wore a 't'-shirt with GGABB on the front. GGABB=Gotta Getta Bigga Boat. Now, as a minor concession to advancing years, I have downsized from 55 to 38. It's amazing just how much the maintenance bill has diminished.

We are in fact making a few minor steps toward trawlers. We chartered one just last month in Canada. It's appealing.....but not quite yet, methinks.
__________________
"if at first you don't succeed....Redefine success"!


Auzzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2019, 02:59 PM   #8
Ensign
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Home Port: Guernsey C.I.
Posts: 7
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RichMac View Post
Are a lot of yachtsmen too casual about anchoring? What can we do to be more secure at anchor?

Please watch the short video, I’m trying to encourage people to take anchoring more seriously, and be safer in strong winds.

https://youtu.be/FOKVO3JBgDY

Too many yachts drag because they use small, old-style anchors, which are often sized for ‘normal’ conditions, so they drag when the wind picks up. The new generation anchors are much more secure.

Traditional scope calculations are also a problem, they are based on rope rodes which are straight, rather than the chain which hangs in a curve.

I use 15m (50ft) plus double the depth, plus an extra 10m (30ft) in strong conditions. The starting length allows for the chain next to the anchor, which is flatter, and the double depth matches the chain at the top, where it is more vertical.
Normal for me is 5 X depth plus 6' I a blow then let out another 50' i have 10mm chain.
I think he makes a lot of sense, certainly a safe way to go, will give it a trial.
__________________
MikeUK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2019, 10:20 PM   #9
Commander
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Home Port: Royston
Posts: 127
Default

I have a couple of 30 lb lead kellets to put on mine. One litre equals 30 lbs of lead. After 30 knots of wind ,chain is bar straight, giving almost no catenery.

In smooth water , anchoring by the stern reduces loads and chafe on anchor rode drastically. By laying like a dead duck ,no shearing around , no fetching up, beam on at speed ,and spinning he whole weight of the boat around ,having only the windage of the transom and the cabin, instead of the windage of beam on, the loads on ground tackle are drastically reduced, to a fraction of that when bow on, in a strong wind .
__________________
Brent Swain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2019, 10:22 PM   #10
Commander
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Home Port: Royston
Posts: 127
Default

Too much scope in a crowded summer anchorage, is rudely taking up far more space than you need. I use a kellet, and give more scope only when the wind pipes up.
__________________
Brent Swain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2019, 10:44 AM   #11
Ensign
 
Seasick Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Home Port: Southampton
Vessel Name: Tyro
Posts: 22
Default

What happens when the tide turns? She can't be very stable, lying stern-on to the stream, and the rudder must be susceptible to damage if the tidal stream is strong.
__________________
Seasick Steve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2019, 06:53 PM   #12
Admiral
 
Auzzee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Home Port: Darwin
Vessel Name: Sandettie
Posts: 1,917
Default

It's a problem to know what amount of chain your neighbours have paid out. It seems mostly that when anchoring off the shore, with exposure being increased with a shift in the wind, that 5 to 7 times the depth is fairly standard. In that event, the boat which is anchored on a short chain becomes the problem when the tide alters direction and those boats with the recommended amount of scope move through 180 degrees.

As always, it is prudent to watch the movement of the boats around you and make adjustments as necessary...or move if you feel other boats are going to compromise your safety.

On three occasions, once in northern Australia, once in the Caribbean and once either in the Philippines or Thailand, other boats alone in an anchorage have contacted me by VHF and advised me of the amount of chain they have out. It's distinctly helpful.

Of course the amount of movement with both tide and wind is dependent to an extent on the weight of chain, the underwater profile of the boat and the windage of its rig...and if you use a kellet, where is it kept on the chain. Is it directly behind the anchor stock, or is it run along the chain to a distance behind the anchor.

I can honestly say that the majority of anchoring problems in busy anchorages have been caused by the boat which cruises up beside you, then drops anchor ahead before falling back to be in line with you, when you know his anchor is just a boat length ahead.

But most sailors are good at anchoring and it is my experience that it is rare to be affected by other boats' anchoring near me...except for the b*****d in Watmough Bay in the San Juans who spent several hours dragging all over the bloody anchorage and laughing about it on the radio.

Finally, it's worth taking a look at the link in the original post on this thread. It is a very thoughtful piece.
__________________
"if at first you don't succeed....Redefine success"!


Auzzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2019, 06:32 PM   #13
Commander
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Home Port: Royston
Posts: 127
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seasick Steve View Post
What happens when the tide turns? She can't be very stable, lying stern-on to the stream, and the rudder must be susceptible to damage if the tidal stream is strong.

Yes ,stern anchoring only works where there is no current.
__________________

__________________
Brent Swain is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
anchor


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Check Regime When Anchoring In Storm? magwas General Cruising Forum 24 12-01-2012 10:00 PM
How To Learn Anchoring? magwas General Cruising Forum 11 08-10-2010 08:30 AM
River Anchoring redbopeep General Cruising Forum 2 06-27-2010 11:46 AM
Anchoring teejay Other Equipment 2 07-04-2009 07:59 PM
Best Way Of Anchoring lynger1 General Cruising Forum 53 02-06-2009 10:29 AM

Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

RV & Travel Trailer Communities

Our RV & Travel Trailer sites encompasses virtually all types of Recreational Vehicles, from brand-specific to general RV communities.

» More about our RV Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:14 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0
×