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Old 09-05-2007, 09:59 AM   #1
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Ladies and Laddies:

Truly a newbie and something of a novice sailor, I am nevertheless, a sailor, and called David, but you can call me Popo, if not Ishmael...

I live in Taiwan, am somewhat tired of my involuntary and quite accidental exile. But it's been so long now, away from my home, that I do not suffer much inkling to return to Canada... EXCEPT to finish restoring my 31 foot Offshore-31 / Bermuda ketch -- by Cheoy Lee, ha-ha...

I am a writer and poet, dreaming of her, sitting on the hard as she still is, on a small island in the Emerald Isles of British Columbia... I've been restoring her little by little -- and it's a long and arduous task, but full of rewards: it's that sense of accomplishment that comes when you rebuild a masthead with your bare hands, carefully replacing the old sheave with a fresh smooth one, then reinforce the old wood with a fiberglass / epoxy head, and paint it all a nice white... Etc... To hand shape and refit new brass bushings into the wooden spreaders so the stainless steel rigging can slide freely... Etc... I am fascinated by my restoration project, though its intricacies are sometimes bewildering: for example, removing the old Atomic 4 gas engine left such a nice big, clean and non-smelly hole to fill. I decided that there was no way I would ever put a diesel engine back inside her. I opted for a nice cooler and will fill the sides with extra water tanks, too... Mount a simple small outboard on the back, which I can also remove and stow below... I am going to be the real thing, a real sailor... In this day and age when everyone is in a BIG hurry to get around, taking their behavior with them out to sea -- no way for me... I know how to wait for the wind, so to say -- and look forward to it...

My plan is to sail the Porchid to Mexico from B.C. in the summer of next year. When my time is up here in December, I'll look for a boat to sail on -- to get some practice in before I return to B.C. to finish the job and slip away at dawn... ( I am not really so original a thinker as I pretend, so will rely on Melville to remind you of what we have forgotten, now and then... )

I have cycled around China and climbed some very high mountain passes in Tibet with my bicycle... You would be surprised to find that there is no cleaner place on Earth, except those places where no man dwells... http://www.angelfire.com/trek/tibet0/Home/Home.htm

I
hope to learn a lot on this website, (before I am banned for being too something far away off center, hopefully left of it, not right...) I know that complacency is today's ailment, from which we all suffer and cannot escape. Excuses are the bread and butter of our polity, and ignorance is often advertised as the golden rule of silent acceptance, and it's the rationale excusing the divisions between great wealth and extreme poverty...

But even so, I hope to learn something useful from those more experienced with the ways of the sea. For it is just as likely that I'll soon be making a quick tour of Davey Jone's locker as I will actually reach, finally, the tropical lassies of Panama and Brazil...

Here is my boat, originally named, "Good Fortune"... Click on her for the big picture...



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

...hell is an idea first born on an undigested apple-dumpling; and since then perpetuated through the hereditary dyspepsias nurtured by Ramadans.

...Melville...
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Old 09-05-2007, 08:11 PM   #2
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David,

Interesting that you have decided on a small outboard to replace the Atomic 4.

The HP required to drive the 31 in headwinds against the current would be near to the 4's max RPM

The mounting of an extra longshaft outboard may also be a challenge and being able to tilt it out of harm's way should also require some engineering.

It looks like the ideal O/B HP would be around 20 - minimum 15.

http://www.cheoyleeassociation.com/O...ff31owners.htm
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Old 09-05-2007, 09:43 PM   #3
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Welcome aboard. It's a lovely boat! One of its sisters (Tearoa) is on the hard here in Darwin. The removal of the engine and replacement with a L/S outboard is an interesting concept. As Richard points out, it will require more than a small, stowable putt-putt to get you off a lee shore in a blow.

With a larger o/b, I suggest you check the strength of the transom and consider reinforcement before mounting the new donk. Also, when installing the new water tanks, try to keep them as close to the centreline and as low as possible to counter the loss of ballast which was provided by the old engine.

Cheers

David.
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Old 09-06-2007, 01:38 AM   #4
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Someone once told me fear guards the gates of freedom...now I'm confused

Welcome aboard! Very nice boat.
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Old 09-06-2007, 05:39 AM   #5
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Quote:
Interesting that you have decided on a small outboard to replace the Atomic 4. The HP required to drive the 31 in headwinds against the current would be near to the 4's max RPM. The mounting of an extra longshaft outboard may also be a challenge and being able to tilt it out of harm's way should also require some engineering. It looks like the ideal O/B HP would be around 20 - minimum 15.
Thanks for the heads up. I have been giving my transom-mount outboard some thought... The good thing, engineering-wise, is the sheer power of a triangle. I realized, especially after hauling the whole boat out of the water, that the transom design on the ketch was deliberately raked back at about 15 and almost 20 degrees... the reason why is quite plain when you remove the water around the boat: the tiller is attached to a very large and heavy solid teak rudder. The only practical way to mount the mass of the rudder was to rake the angle back, so that the mounting hinges distribute the mass of the solid teak on an angle, which permits gravity to stretch the load out, instead of forcing it all down at a ninety degree angle. The great thing about the transom, consequently, is that if you mount a couple of twin triangles, made of fresh stainless, and link them with three crossbars, or two center bars offset to distribute the mass evenly, then you can easily visualize how the mass of a motor is evenly carried along the whole length of the sharply angle transom... The main thing is to perhaps, make sure that the transom itself is firmly joined to the lateral parts of the hull sides, and that it is simply thick enough to endure the heavy bolting and long ride demanded by the stainless apparatus. She must be something like a cross between an exotic dancer and a marathon runner, with plenty of muscle to endure the sea's fits of frustration. I am hopeful. Mounting the outboard is not difficult, but making it easy to lift up and unbolt strikes me as a difficult prospect. I will do my best to find a way ...

15 or 20 HP, that's bigger than I can manhandle without hiring a big girl to go along with me, man... Any suggestions as to how to get the thing off the handle and into the hold, would be keenly considered by me... Otherwise, I am dreaming in technicolor... oh well...
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Old 09-06-2007, 05:57 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trim50 View Post
Someone once told me fear gaurds the gates of freedom...now I'm confused

Welcome aboard! Very nice boat.
Howdy, well, I just searched for: "Melville quotes" and that is what came up, my man: "Ignorance is the parent of fear..." It does ring true, though, doesn't it? Melville was a sly one, and knew how to convey that uneasy sense of knocking-knees that probably overcame everyone in face of a tempest or a big whale with no wish to give in... Ignorance is the parent of fear, but of course, we moderns would think this a good thing, because anything that can give us added caution, or breath, would probably also be something nature could use to make us wise... So, Melville is attempting to mimic the laws of nature with such statements -- and perhaps deliberately contrasting natural wisdom with some of the more arbitrary and foreign pronouncements given to us by Christianity... Maybe he is drawing parallels where none were observed before... Attempting, perhaps, to make peace, annul the marriage of opposites, and say simply: accept the way you feel as the way of nature... while at the same time, he wishes you gain the higher ground, from which truth statements are made... but to free ourselves from illusions? )
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Old 09-06-2007, 08:44 AM   #7
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The rudder mounting angle is much more to do with balance and ease of steering than anything else. If the rudder was to drop perpendicular to the water's surface, it would need to be exposed and unattached to the keel so that the fulcrum could be behind the leading edge of the rudder.. Otherwise, Popo would need three sheilas with very powerful arms to steer the boat for any length of time.

With great respect, I must say the outboard has the potential to become a horror story. A nifty little, quiet, non-pongy 18hp Yanmar diesel inboard would be just the ant's pants.

Cheers

David.

PS. Regarding Herman. He was an unpretentious storyteller not a philosopher. Fear of the unknown is an age old, easily understood concept which doesn't deserve to be corrupted through analysis.
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Old 09-06-2007, 11:56 PM   #8
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Returning to the question of Replacing the Atomic 4 gasoline engine with an appropriate Outboard engine - requires more thought and design to accomplish a means of propulsion for the Offshore 31.

Specifically :- if 15 Hp is accepted as the minimum power required - then where to store the fuel ??

1) in the exist fuel tank 2) in jerry cans ? Reason for the question an gasoline outboard has an insatiable appetite !

Therefore if the overriding reason is to get rid of the Atomic 4 is gasoline then replacing with a gasoline outboard only solves half the equation.

Solution :- replace with small diesel - eg Yanmar 18 : Universal 10.

OR A Yanmar diesel OUTBOARD - see http://www.yanmar.com.au/marine/d_series/dseries.htm

This outboard when running at a quiet 1700 RPM produces tons of torque - safe and fuel efficient.

The installation best achieved by Davits over the stern with a engine slide bracket which hinges Check this hinge design for 60% of the solution :- http://www.discountmarinesupplies.com/prod...p;product=92833

Brackets.jpg
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Old 09-07-2007, 04:46 PM   #9
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Thanks for the info on the Yanmar!

Evinrude has a multi-fuel outboard that was developed for the special forces.

http://gov.evinrude.com/

http://www.marineenginedigest.com/fe...vinrudemfe.htm
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Old 09-10-2007, 03:32 AM   #10
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Hey fellas, thanks for all the suggestions... I appreciate it. I really don't want to put another engine inside the boat. You know, it is only 31 feet long, and although pretty heavy at 11,500 lbs, I want to use the space in a more modern way. I want to make this boat my home for six months to a year beginning next spring, so I want to make it comfortable... My training ground will be the Emerald Isles around the east side of Vancouver Island. I don't know if any of you have ever been there... But it is a fairly pacific sailing area, with mild to middling summer winds and much better autumnal breezes... I won't need the engine except when I am traversing a tidal channel between two of the larger north-south waterways. Of course, a tough little number would be best, but I was actually thinking of about a 9 horse long-shaft.

By the way, I already have one of those stainless motor mounts: but due to the extraordinary steep backward rake on my transom, I must design and have built a stainless extender mount. One concept suggested to me by a local old salt was a cylindrical tube, about 6 inches in diameter, cut on an angle then welded to a flat piece of stainless plate. The motor mount shown in the links above will attach to the end of the cylinder, which in turn is further supported by two triangular brackets that run up from the main plate on the transom to the top stern edge of the transom... all bolted through the transom solidly. There is no other way to do it. In this way the motor is accessible directly off the stern rail and drops down from that point straight down below the water... I hope to be able to remove the motor and stow it below the cockpit during normal sailing, and just pop it onto the mount when approaching port, or in the event of some other exigency, like evading some of those rocks in the channels; of course, in this latter instance, I would keep the motor on the mount until I had finally cleared the north end of Vancouver island, and then would bring my course around due south; (look at a map, and you will see that the north end of Vancouver island is "200 miles" out from the west coast of Oregon and California...) Do you think I'll have to avoid some Russian freighters that far out? I heard they can be nasty about not noticing little boats... Just teasing, but I am serious about keeping my boat ecologically and aesthetically attractive... There is A LOT of space below the cockpit where the Atomic 4 used to be... I can fit in a bicycle, a cooler, some water tanks and the 9 horse motor... Room above the cockpit under the back seat/locker for a small tank of fuel...

And thanks for the links to diesel motors... If you find any small small diesel outboards, let me know... I know they make them in China and Viet Nam, but the layout isn't quite right for my boat...

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Old 09-10-2007, 04:46 AM   #11
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"If you find any small small diesel outboards, let me know... I know they make them in China and Viet Nam, but the layout isn't quite right for my boat..."



Hi,

What do you mean by small diesel outboards ? What HP ? Do you have makes ex. China/Veitnam
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