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Old 08-26-2012, 02:21 AM   #15
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Coyote--our Luka is in Argentina, not the USA

In this topic, regarding use of "systems engineer" he's talking about being an IT person who does typical project management and (not so typical) large scale data center design/management and this is in the most traditional of systems engineering. You never can tell what people are talking about in IT though. In the IT world things are constantly changing so titles and names change as well. You can even take a 6 course program like this one and call yourself an IT Systems Engineer. Calling oneself an engineer does not make one an engineer.

In the USA, the discipline of systems engineering takes its roots in the IM&T world of good old Ma Bell and a systems engineer is typically someone who has at least a bachelor's degree in an engineering discipline from an ABET accredited university and it is just as likely to be someone with a master's degree in electrical, mechanical, chemical or industrial engineering.
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Old 08-26-2012, 03:25 AM   #16
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Hi Linnupesa, being a remote landlord is probably easier than being close to your property. I am lucky in that I have relatives in my home who pay a reduced rent, but who maintain the property as if it was their own. I am glad that I do not need to rely on rental agents.

I think the key to making money whilst cruising is to not have high expectations. If I wanted to work on radio, or in newspapers as a journalist, I would rarely get a job as no one in that field wants 'casuals'. So I work on the assumption that if I find a job and do a week's work, someone will give me some money. What the job is, is of little importance and even if it is an awful job, pergatory doesn't last forever. And there is always the take-yer-job-n-shove-it option.

The only thing I am yet to determine as a hard and fast rule, is which gets priority; me or the boat.
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Old 08-26-2012, 05:28 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by redbopeep View Post
You never can tell what people are talking about in IT though. In the IT world things are constantly changing so titles and names change as well. You can even take a 6 course program like this one and call yourself an IT Systems Engineer. Calling oneself an engineer does not make one an engineer.
You can say that again. Many people calling themselves a "computer engineer" these days are card jockeys who have barely learned to use a screwdriver and only know how to configure the last few versions of Windoze.

I earned the title in 1978 after an intensive electronics course and 12 months in a national support workshop for a major international manufacturer, working alongside ex-airline engineers who could repair 6-layer boards to component level. And I outperformed them all. When I told people I was a computer engineer back then, most would reply, "What's a computer?" :-)

Of course these days I'm unemployable. Even doing embedded system design and firmware doesn't pay much, and companies come and go like the weather.

Portable skills? Not on a yacht without mains power and a shipload of spares. I might make a few bucks fixing radios or wiring, but I wouldn't count on it.

Only 6 more years before I can draw a pension ...

Rob
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Old 08-26-2012, 06:14 AM   #18
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Auzzee et al

that's great having relatives who actually do look after things in a rental. What a load off your mind. Now where do I go to find some for me?

As to working on boats, there should be opportunities for fix-it people of all stripes. The modern trend to more complex systems should allow anyone with a bit of understanding of "what makes things go" to find work in an anchorage. I'm sure even many of the fancy and maintained vessels have issues from bad hoses and pumps to faulty wiring. There is a plethora of systems to go down and often 90% of the fix is the correct diagnosis of the fault.

My own question is "how do you market your skills" to an unknown but potential audience? You can't really fly a big "mobile service" banner without push-back from the locals. Even if they cannot duplicate your services by a really long shot.

The idea of finding part-time work on shore is appealing but also has it's own problems. Dress code for one and commuting, unless you choose to temporarily live ashore. Running a boat-based business most likely requires some internet connection, so forget about anchoring in any remote place. Yet it might work around many of the populated coastal areas.

Ivo s/v Linnupesa
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Old 08-26-2012, 06:30 AM   #19
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Hi Ivo,

I'm pretty sure that for most trades the ire of the locals would make life difficult. There are some, such as journalism and medicine, which form an exception.

As you say, commuting isn't really practical. And it's hard enough to secure a yacht and its dinghy in most places without continuously tempting fate.

For this lifestyle one either needs adequate savings or a continuous income stream that needs little management. As I've recently realized, there are two ways to be rich:

1. Have lots of money.
2. Lower your costs - and maybe also your needs and expectations - to meet the available funds.

The second option puts one at odds with society, but it's fiscally responsible and carries a low carbon footprint to boot. Refer to "Atlas Shrugged" by Ayn Rand and "The £200 Millionaire" by Weston Martyr to see that this doesn't necessarily make one a criminal or a hippy.

With recycling - even dumpster diving, in the extreme case - acquired skills and simple systems it should still be possible to live on a very meagre income while seeing the world.

The costly items are fuel, eating out and paying a premium for parts/repairs in remote locations. All these costs can be minimized if the need is there. There are also entry and exit fees but I consider them unavoidable, just stay in places that charge a reasonable rate.

As for irrational costs like smoking and drinking, I'm not going to get into an argument about personal choices. I rarely drink but I smoke 50 cigarettes a day which, in Australia, costs me $26.50/day and a strong tolerance of the "social engineering by fiscal punishment" that has crept upon our society in the name of health care.

It would be advantageous to live somewhere else, and in fact for the difference in the tax on cigarettes alone I could live in SE Asia quite well. Regular drinkers should consider home brewing.

Rob
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Old 08-26-2012, 07:01 AM   #20
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Haiku, where I am at the moment (Thailand), the average wage for a labourer is about 175 baht a day. The government has recently announced that all university graduates will receive a minimum 15,000baht a month salary and police and soldiers receive 8,000-10,000 baht per month. Your cigarette allowance ($26.50 per day) translates to 26,000 baht per month, which is a great wage here. I don't smoke but I think 50 fags a day here would cost you 250baht ($7.50).
It has its charms, but I wouldn't want to live here permanently and, as always, ya gets what ya pays for.
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Old 08-26-2012, 10:29 AM   #21
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And that $19/day difference translates into $570/month which is more than the $500/month target I was aiming for, including maintenance. Yup, buying a yacht is the smartest thing I ever did, can't wait to join you up there.

Of course, once I get a lung full of the old briny and a bit of exercise I'm expecting the habit to evaporate of its own accord anyhow. And I'm sure the warmer weather will give me a taste for cold beer. Might even make a real Aussie out of me after all.

Cheers,

Rob
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Old 08-26-2012, 03:28 PM   #22
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Hi All,
I'm an arm-chair sailor and my guesstimate for a cruising life, in the present economy, is $2000 usd per month over a two year period. This includes
one haul -out, flights home once a year and occasional restaurant. now lets hope
the more experienced sailor, even experienced arm-chair sailor, can fine tune this.
One day soon........ my arm-chair will float!
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Old 08-26-2012, 04:34 PM   #23
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The answer to the cost of cruising is: It will cost you whatever you have.

I intend to do it way cheaper than $2000/month, but then I'm willing to cut back on some things that might be seen as "necessary" by others. Armchair sailor or not, I've been feeding and housing myself for a long time, and know what it costs to repair any of the systems on a yacht.

There's a separate thread covering this, you might like to chime in there.

http://www.cruiserlog.com/forums/f12...mple-6795.html

Rob
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Old 08-26-2012, 04:57 PM   #24
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Lets see Llamedos, in current $US

tie-up at a relatively cheaper marina with showers and close to shopping runs around $350-500 per month.

Food 350-500, eating out 100-250 Fuel and cooking 200, spares and maintenance 200, insurance 150, bi-annual flights 100, miscellaneous 150, medical 50-150

Totted up that's ca. 2200 in the "high" range and 1100 in the "low" one. The low range you might further reduce by anchoring out and using less fuel, eating simple with no eating out, no insurance etc. to get to the $500-700 range. Some do with less even.

It is not a princely lifestyle but do-able and you can have a lot fun and satisfaction along the way, under sail or on your bike.

The biggest killers imho are medical and insurance. In the US the whole medical system is a jobs-mill. Instead of fighting disease it fights claims and lawsuits. Without insurance and big pharma involved health costs would be quite reasonable, as in many other countries.

Never mind that our wacko lifestyles create a whole new range of ills, from diabetes and lack of exercise to unhealthy food and PTSD. Can't wait to hear about the future health cost implications from Iphone addictions. Both mental and physical.

Floating armchair? Plenty of under-water houses to choose here too, LLamedos. Many come furnished too.

Ivo s/v Linnupesa and with bicycle.
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Old 08-26-2012, 07:22 PM   #25
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Hi guys,

This thread is by-and-large about making money while underway. While saving money and living cheaply is, by-and-large, the way that cruisers manage to extend their cruising--I'd like us to be focused about suggesting ways to (legally and ethically) make money while living a cruising life. Waiting until one is eligible for a pension, for example, doesn't work for a fellow who's 30 years old, ya know?
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Old 08-26-2012, 10:31 PM   #26
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Good Point Brenda,

Here is items that we are looking at as options for income:

1) Myself practicing part time or doing locums where I am able (I hold a Doctorate in Chiropractic and have experience in Sports sciences/medicine).
2) My wife has skills with fabric work from lace and ribbon to working with canvas (which I can help with the heavy fabrics as once own a business making tents).
3)She has experience in working with CSS and three of the modern shopping cart systems for websites and knows what is required to meet EU regulations for those wishing to do business there.
4) We have both done translation work from Italian to English.
5) We are both musicians (she is much more skilled then I) and can play at a public performance levels. She knows how to teach folks.
6) I have experience in wood working, carpentry/masonry skills (thanks USAR) and own and know how to run a CNC gantry router as well as other CNC machinery.
7) My wife can strip an engine down to its bare parts and rebuild it by herself (diesels are her preferred type as she grew up with a father who worked on Detroit, Cummings, Doitz, and S&S gensets (the big ones).
8) We both have graphic Art back ground though from different sides of the coin. She is the computer wiz at it and I can write in 9 different calligraphic hands as well as draw and other such.

This plus investments that we have and are making will cover most our costs while sailing. The Gantry router I own is one meter long by 700mm wide by 750mm tall and can be completely taken down as it is fully indexed and is capable of cutting steel. I currently make musical instrument parts with it.

We plan on adding further skill sets to this as we are preparing to go and the kids are taking to music well so we will see how things on that front (oldest may be competing in the UK this year in chromatic harmonica).

We have gotten very good at cooking and are accused by family and friends of living a caviar lifestyle on shoestring budget. It really depends on what you have and how you look at it. We both consider work a valuable part of life as it is taking ones skills/talents/gifts and using them; which is what they are meant for to begin with.

Michael
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Old 08-27-2012, 03:56 AM   #27
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Michael,

That's a great list of skills which can help you keep the dips into the kitty down--and allow you to do a range of enjoyable things whilst you travel!

I like it. How old are the kids?
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Old 08-27-2012, 02:56 PM   #28
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Well, a lot of responses, much more than my expectations, thanks!

Unfortunately we are not from USA. As says redbopeep we`r from Argentina, here no profecional wins too much except to go into the business world. But that is far from what we want for our future.

In fact we want a simpler life, my family comes from traders and travelers. Until we have a saying "We will always survive"

Systems engineer is referred to a long career of six years studies at the National University. So it's true that my professional knowledge can be economically profitable. But for now I want another experience. Developing more practical skills that allow us to be out of the system. Is this possible? well here we go with the experiment. We can always go back to start all over again.

Expectations? Hot food, nature, smile on face, good lessons for my son, new good friends. adventures? is all we want. We do not attract the luxuries, the material does not interest us.

Going over the details. I tell my calculations. U $ s 400 each for feeding and maintenance and $ 400 more for the boat. A total of $ 1,500 for the entire monthly budget. Although I hope to lower it a bit, but to be outside.

And I have a cost not very clear. The sails, takes about 4 to 5 years if proper care?

I read your comments very gratefully.
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