Firearms On Board

I have a pistol, registrate in my name. I thought of leaving it behind when I start my cruising live.I can imagine complications entering other countries. When I read about piracy and stealing and all sceary things happening around the globe I get worried Though.How do you protect your wife, boat and belongings out there?

Can you experienced cruisers out there please help me to make a well educated decition about this matter?

[Trim50]

The concensus seems to be "no guns". Most will stay clear of this subject as it has been beaten into the gound month after month.

The piracy isn't statistically significant to concern yourself...most just want water or cigarettes. So, if you take your gun, buy a lottery ticket while you're at it.

Cheers,

Ken

[atavist]

At the moment I am planning on keeping one pistol onboard when I finally get my own boat... like you I just can't imagine being unarmed.... of course it will be a few years before I can buy my own boat... so I will obviously not have a gun while working on other peoples boats... in that time I may change my mind and find enough security in a spear gun, gaff, machete, etc...

For those who have been out and around... assuming a person isn't doing anything stupid to bring negative attention to themselves what are the odds of a foreign customs office actually searching your boat? have you ever had your boat searched??

[JeanneP]

Various discussions on arms on this board: http://www.cruiserlog.com/forums/index.php...amp;hl=firearms

http://www.cruiserlog.com/forums/index.php...amp;hl=firearms

http://www.cruiserlog.com/forums/index.php...amp;hl=firearms

[Trim50]

I was pro-gun...I have since changed my position on the subject. Mostly due to the real hassle it would present and the fact that you can do just as much with a good flare gun.

[atavist]

Any chance they make a good semi-auto flare gun?? that would definitely fill the bill.

[Robinsvoyage]

I would reply more in depth, sir, but the problem is if you use common sense and carry you get beaten up and bashed by ill-informed, naive, close-minded, and Utopian people, who believe the police will always be there to defend you and would rather lie down to potential slaughter than take a stand. Just keep in mind you don't hear from the people who were murdered and pushed over the side to prevent the incident from being reported. Just use common sense, be a good guy, always be honest, and remember there is no 911 (or 999) in transit.Robin

Originally Posted by Tollos

I have a pistol, registrate in my name. I thought of leaving it behind when I start my cruising live.I can imagine complications entering other countries. When I read about piracy and stealing and all sceary things happening around the globe I get worried Though.How do you protect your wife, boat and belongings out there? Can you experienced cruisers out there please help me to make a well educated decition about this matter?

[Auzzee]

Robin,

Those people you describe as 'ill-informed, naive, close-minded, untopians(sic)' are the same people who supported you in the lead up to your attempt to cross the Pacific. The same people who supported you when you disappeared from the boards when you trip did not conclude as you had planned. They are also people who will continue to give you support, now that you have chosen to try cruising again.

They are people from across the world, not just America, who are cruising in boats, not trucks, and who have carefully considered their position on firearms and do no more than try to honestly answer questions from people who genuinely seek answers, rather than seeking to champion a cause presided over by a has-been who for some reason frightens the crap out of the American political establishment.

This is not an American question on a mid-western American board! It is an international question on an international board which demands an informed, international response from people who have more experience than theory.

"......would rather lie down than make a stand...."

To describe, as you have, the vast majority of cruisers from across the globe as cowards, is particularly offensive.

By all means put your case..again and again and again.. if you must, but you must avoid making stupid allegations against people who genuinely know, from experience, what they are talking about.

Like Trim50, I was also in favour of guns on cruising yachts, but after actually cruising internationally, I am now also one of those who tossed my rifle into the ocean.

David.

[dnelson]

Originally Posted by Auzzee

Robin,

This is not an American question on a mid-western American board! It is an international question on an international board which demands an informed, international response from people who have more experience than theory.

"......would rather lie down than make a stand...."

To describe, as you have, the vast majority of cruisers from across the globe as cowards, is particularly offensive.

By all means put your case..again and again and again.. if you must, but you must avoid making stupid allegations against people who genuinely know, from experience, what they are talking about.

Like Trim50, I was also in favour of guns on cruising yachts, but after actually cruising internationally, I am now also one of those who tossed my rifle into the ocean.

David.

Well Said David -

People who want to go cruising talk about carrying guns - people who have gone cruising know you don't need them.

[ExCalif]

Originally Posted by Auzzee

This is not an American question on a mid-western American board! It is an international question on an international board which demands an informed, international response from people who have more experience than theory.

I don't get into the "gun debate." If it's legal and you want to carry go ahead. You don't want to carry, don't.

However in the interest of "informed" debate.

Singapore -

2 guns = trafficking in arms = death penalty

1 gun = possession = 5-10 years and 6 strokes

Use a gun regardless of reason = death penalty

A gun is broadly defined here and yes can include flare guns.

I haven't heard of any cruising boat being arrested for a flare gun. I would guess that if you left it on board, stayed on a mooring and did not dock up - where someone could easily pinch it - you'd be OK.

I sure as hell wouldn't test them however...

Follow the law - end of debate.

Singapore arms law -

http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/non_version/cgi...=whole&sl=1

[Harbor_Pilot]

Originally Posted by KiwiAussie

Unless I'm mistaken, I think Robinsvoyage is currently cruising.

What gave you that idea? I think you are mistaken.

His present boat is on the hard in the desert:

Visiting Hard Knocks Here

He plans to get his new boat in December:

Meet the William Bligh Here

~ ~ ~

When I first caught the sailing fever, and read of pirates, I was pro-gun, planning to have pistols, rifles and shotguns on board. Now knowing more about it, I changed my mind as many others have. Planning to take them, with the purpose of protecting against something virtually non-existant (the boggie man), makes little sense, knowing having them will cause real problems and big problems, upon entering many countries.

I think it makes more sense to study countries laws and customs, their language and culture, be aware of travel advisories, and avoid the known hot spots and troubled areas. Simply think and be smart; I call it street smarts.

[Robinsvoyage]

Dave, I've sailed all over the world, in Scotland, Australia, and in the US. I don't live in the mid-west, by the way. Aren't you a little tired of the same issue being brought up with the same people arguing? I have experience with firearms, self defense, and sailing, do you wish to stifle what I assume to be an informed and experience-driven opinion?

Thanks,

Robin

Obviously the "untopian" should be Utopian. I think you'll have to explain the "sic" to the other members, but not someone who was an English major.

[Robinsvoyage]

It's the Hard Knots not the Hard Knocks and it's on a trailer and hasn't been used since I pulled it out of the ocean in 2005. The vessel I had before was Luana in Hawaii. Theone I just bought is in Maine and is called the William Bligh, named for someone who would probably agree with me, by the way.

Robin

Originally Posted by Harbor_Pilot

What gave you that idea? I think you are mistaken.

His present boat is on the hard in the desert:

Visiting Hard Knocks Here

He plans to get his new boat in December:

Meet the William Bligh Here

~ ~ ~

When I first caught the sailing fever, and read of pirates, I was pro-gun, planning to have pistols, rifles and shotguns on board. Now knowing more about it, I changed my mind as many others have. Planning to take them, with the purpose of protecting against something virtually non-existant (the boggie man), makes little sense, knowing having them will cause real problems and big problems, upon entering many countries.

I think it makes more sense to study countries laws and customs, their language and culture, be aware of travel advisories, and avoid the known hot spots and troubled areas. Simply think and be smart; I call it street smarts.

[Robinsvoyage]

Thank you all for proving my point about those of us who still believe in personal responsibility and individual rights. Many of us keep quiet because we don't like getting attacked or called ill-informed. I submit to you that I am not only informed, but having lived in the UK, Australia, Canada, and the USA, am probably better traveled and well versed in international politics than most of you. Your comments and positions are exactly what I expect and know from the elitists that populate most of the sailing community globally. As for me, I'm not rich, I save harder than any of you realize to enjoy the freedom and leisure that I crave every day of my life and that is bored into my bones.

Thank you and remember my words, especially if you're ever in the process of realizing that I was right.

I don't think I need to express any views on these message boards anymore.

As for me I will be enjoying my freedom, sailing, flying, driving, exploring the world and meeting new people,

Yours Forever,

Robin

[seaview31]

If you are so worried why on earth you want to go cruising? Make no sence, you already build enough stress to have a heart attack!!!! take a cruise ship or see the world by plane I am afraid you never make it ,if you already have a yacht sail in your home waters,you ..However if you change your attitude and be more positive than by ALL MEANS GO FOR IT AS THERE IS NOTHING IN THIS PLANET SO FULLFILLING,THE JOY AND HAPPINESS SAILING ON A SAILING YACHT is total Bliss.I been sailing for over 25 years now and still feel that `pleasure of freedom` so go do not worried too much about pirates do your homework before you leave and you be ok

My best advise regarding your problem is that if you carry a fire arm you CAN CREATE HELL FOR YOU AND YOUR DEAR FAMILY. Having a gun aboard is always trouble,can you imagine shooting or killing someone say in a third world country? or if you do not declare the weopen and they search your ship which 99% in these counties they do and they find your gun you could be arrested ; beside a very heavy fine, and what about if a boat full of men armed with heavy weapens what can you do/or if the same boat heading towards your yacht and later you find that they were simple fishermen looking for cigarette s/whisky and you kill/injury one of them etc,etc I have experianced similiar situations in the Red Sea (sailed 5 times) Sri lanka and Cape Verde

Leave your gun at home;- enjoy the pleasure of cruising you never regreted.

Joseph

S.Y Bahhar

F31

Malta

[Auzzee]

Yes Robin, I get tired of this topic, but the site is dynamic and as such there are always new people seeking information. For the sake of those new participants, I suggested you couild re-present your opinion as often as you choose.

My concern is purely that you cease to label as cowards,those who disagree with you. Again I say that was particularly offensive to the majority of cruisers who may have wives, husbands, lovers and children to protect, as well as themselves and possibly a cat.

You will always be welcome here and you will always receive support as long as you don't adopt an offensive stance every time someone puts forward a contrary opinion.

Best wishes

David.

[ExCalif]

Originally Posted by KiwiAussie

You can declare firearms to customs on arrival into Singapore.

I don't mean to be rude but to make a statement like that without a citation or some proof is downright reckless.

I have never heard that you can declare a firearm and have it OK with the Singapore government. I could perhaps see "bonding" the item, that is turning it over to customs until you depart but I doubt they would let you keep it on board during your stay.

The other surrounding Asian countries also have very stiff penalties for firearms.

My advice is simple - Don't take any advice on this from the internet. If you have weapons on board I would suggest "strongly" that you contact Singapore customs directly.

[Harbor_Pilot]

Originally Posted by ExCalif

I don't mean to be rude but to make a statement like that without a citation or some proof is downright reckless.

.......

The other surrounding Asian countries also have very stiff penalties for firearms.

My advice is simple - Don't take any advice on this from the internet. If you have weapons on board I would suggest "strongly" that you contact Singapore customs directly.

Very good advice.

Stating sources lends credibility.

The official US advice and saying is, "Know before you go."

The man in uniform and with the badge is not going to buy, "I read it on the internet...."

He may not even know what the internet is. He knows he has a stack of big books under the counter, (or a small pamphlet in his hip pocket) and that is what he is going by. That is what matters.

[Harbor_Pilot]

Originally Posted by Robinsvoyage

It's the Hard Knots not the Hard Knocks and it's on a trailer and hasn't been used since I pulled it out of the ocean in 2005.

Robin

Robin,

Please forgive my typo.

That is what I read and said (based upon your posts that you were not currently cruising.) Thanks for the confirmation and clarification.

Fair Winds,

Jeff

[Bedouin]

I, from my own experience and from others in conversation by and large don't carry firearms. As Robin would know from cruising in Australia that your firearms are confiscated; there is no tolerence for civilians having firearms in Australia. A yacht from overseas will have the firearms removed and you must return to the port of entry to pick up your weapons on leaving Australia; or forfit. The areas where pirates opperate are well known so if you go into those areas your risks will increase of encounter with pirates. Most of the areas are totally free of pirates. Cruise in those areas and you won't need a gun!! If your approached by a local boat try being friendly but play it safe. Most want to trade or ask where you've come from etc..

Areas that piracy is a way of life be guarded because you may well need more than firearms if you want to keep them from approaching. Pull your 'pop gun' out and start waving it about and you will be taken out while they are still out of your firing range. You may well be red faced after the encounter but VERY LIKELY unharmed but missing some booze and cigarettes.

Finally don't NOT DECLARE your firearms; you will loose them for sure.

Regards

Peter