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06-24-2007, 11:31 AM
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#1
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Lieutenant
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 84
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I am wanting to install a water bladder. The spaces is at an angle and not tall enough to fully fill a bladder.
This is under the aft bunk and is only 8 inches and smaller going aft but over 68 inches long and about 36 inches wide. Not very usable. Can I put a stock 10 inch tall bladder in there without much problems in a 3 year coastal cruise?
Do I need to do anything to keep it from moving around? Chaft? Any other thing I should know?
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Cruising Bahamas
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06-24-2007, 01:04 PM
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#2
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Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
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Hi there,
We've only had a water bladder for about 10 months. So far, no problems. I worry constantly about the connections--but that's just me. It is kept in place by its own weight and the size of the space it resides in, we haven't secured it in any other way. If we were going cruising, we'd put a couple web straps across the top as it could possibly move if we were REALLY heeled. Its under a seat and we have access to it via a panel under the seat cushion. It could come out of that panel--thus a reason for straps. We've needed the access to push air out of it a couple times--if we fill the tank too quickly with our hose, we can get as much air in the bladder as water. A slow fill does the trick without need for burping it. This experience makes me realize I wouldn't want a bladder someplace that I couldn't squeeze the air out. No chafe to speak of but we haven't been cruising with it.
Good luck!
P.S. That sounds like a great place to store some emergency building materials. I have stainless rod, wire, old rigging kept as spare parts, plywood, all kinds of things that are hard to find a home for onboard and would fit such a location.
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06-24-2007, 01:47 PM
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#3
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Admiral
Join Date: Jan 2005
Home Port: Darwin
Vessel Name: Sandettie
Posts: 1,917
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Hi Lynx,
My experience with bladders is that they have eyelets on the seam for the purpose of holding them down. This generally would mean a lateral rather than a vertical anchor. I would ensure the bladder is secured even if it conforms to the structure in which it is kept. In the event of a knock down, 100 litres of water has the same momentum potential as a very big man. Imagine a 220lb unconscious man bouncing around below deck during a knock down and you can imagine the damage the full bladder could do.
Putting a 10" high bladder in an 8" high space should not be a huge problem as long as the covering over the space is solid and well anchored. Most bladders I guess do not have enough baffles to prevent a hydraulic surge which could easily lift the not-so-well-screwed-down bed base above it.
Chafing will always be of concern purely because there is a fluid in a non rigid structure. If it can move, it will chafe. However, I think the quality of modern materials is such that chafe will only be a problem where the bladder comes into contact with sharp or protruding objects.
I had installed an 80 litre bladder in a previous boat. I was careful to loop plumbing lines to prevent stress on the fittings and it worked well. The only problem was no matter what I tried I could not rid the thing of the plastic taste....and I tried everything from sodium bicarbonate to tablets, powders, chemicals.
I think bladders are an excellent choice for emergency water and a far better proposition than lashing jerry cans to the safety railings on deck.
Cheese
David.
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" if at first you don't succeed....Redefine success"!
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06-24-2007, 06:32 PM
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#4
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Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auzzee
Hi Lynx,
My experience with bladders is that they have eyelets on the seam for the purpose of holding them down.
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Yes, and the eyelets look very wimpy in comparison to the weight of the bladder--thus if possible placing web tie downs over the bladder (secured to something stout on the either side of it) makes more sense.
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06-24-2007, 11:14 PM
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#5
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Admiral
Join Date: Jan 2005
Home Port: Darwin
Vessel Name: Sandettie
Posts: 1,917
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Regarding the integrity of the eyelets; I had the same concerns as redbopeep when I purchased my water bladder. The manufacturers technical information stated clearly that each eyelet was designed to hold the weight of the bladder when full. I took this to mean the suspended weight, not the swinging weight.
In most cases the bladders have four eyelets through double thicknesses of welded material which will keep the 'tank' under control. Although I did not use any straps over the tank, I guess they would be useful when the tank is full, but may lose their effectiveness, proportionate to the reducing volume of the bladder unless a 'net' style of web weave is employed.
Either way, it is unwise to keep anything of such bulk on your boat without tying it down.
David
PS..I should point out that I have no experience with the Plastimo bladders sold by WM. They are a nylon sleeve containing a PVC liner. The style I used was a very tough orange coloured fabric moulded over a synthetic webbed mesh (much like the make-up of a radial tyre). Looking at the blue nylon bladders, I can fully understand redbopeeps concerns about the 'wimpy' eyelets of that style of container.
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" if at first you don't succeed....Redefine success"!
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06-24-2007, 11:35 PM
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#6
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Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
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Ours is the blue WM type.
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06-24-2007, 11:46 PM
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#7
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Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
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Lashing things to safety railings (be it water, fuel, etc) always seems like a bad idea to me. Even if lashed to deck fittings made specifically for this purpose (not having to use those for the lifelines) I don't like the idea. Things are in the way on deck, likely to be lost overboard, and likely to do damage to crew or boat when that big wave takes them out. My husband and I have had quite a few testy little rows over this--I'm the "stash it away" person because of my caution and desire for orderliness--and he's the "lash it on" type of guy because he likes to "see" things and have them "convenient" and he's much more confident of his knots than I am of mine  .
I agree about the webbing/net option instead of just web cargo straps straight over. I haven't figured this one out--which is why our water bladder is just sitting below that seat rather than being more strongly secured.
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06-25-2007, 04:02 AM
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#8
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Lieutenant
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 84
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Eyelets - One maker I was able to access their web site and instructions. They said that their eyelets was not for supporting the Bladder. This was the black, more expensive at West Marine. It would take real strong ones to handle sea conditions with a 1/2 full tank surging around.
Thanks, Please keep it up. I may just buy 2 and when/if one goes replace it.
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