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08-26-2012, 09:29 AM
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#21
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Admiral
Join Date: May 2011
Home Port: Bundarra, NSW
Vessel Name: None
Posts: 1,556
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And that $19/day difference translates into $570/month which is more than the $500/month target I was aiming for, including maintenance. Yup, buying a yacht is the smartest thing I ever did, can't wait to join you up there.
Of course, once I get a lung full of the old briny and a bit of exercise I'm expecting the habit to evaporate of its own accord anyhow. And I'm sure the warmer weather will give me a taste for cold beer. Might even make a real Aussie out of me after all.
Cheers,
Rob
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"The cure for anything is salt water... sweat, tears, or the sea" -- Isak Dinesen
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08-26-2012, 02:28 PM
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#22
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Ensign
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 19
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llamedos
Hi All,
I'm an arm-chair sailor and my guesstimate for a cruising life, in the present economy, is $2000 usd per month over a two year period. This includes
one haul -out, flights home once a year and occasional restaurant. now lets hope
the more experienced sailor, even experienced arm-chair sailor, can fine tune this.
One day soon........ my arm-chair will float!
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08-26-2012, 03:34 PM
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#23
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Admiral
Join Date: May 2011
Home Port: Bundarra, NSW
Vessel Name: None
Posts: 1,556
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The answer to the cost of cruising is: It will cost you whatever you have.
I intend to do it way cheaper than $2000/month, but then I'm willing to cut back on some things that might be seen as "necessary" by others. Armchair sailor or not, I've been feeding and housing myself for a long time, and know what it costs to repair any of the systems on a yacht.
There's a separate thread covering this, you might like to chime in there.
http://www.cruiserlog.com/forums/f12...mple-6795.html
Rob
__________________
"The cure for anything is salt water... sweat, tears, or the sea" -- Isak Dinesen
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08-26-2012, 03:57 PM
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#24
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Commander
Join Date: Jul 2009
Home Port: St. Augustine FL
Vessel Name: Linnupesa
Posts: 189
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Lets see Llamedos, in current $US
tie-up at a relatively cheaper marina with showers and close to shopping runs around $350-500 per month.
Food 350-500, eating out 100-250 Fuel and cooking 200, spares and maintenance 200, insurance 150, bi-annual flights 100, miscellaneous 150, medical 50-150
Totted up that's ca. 2200 in the "high" range and 1100 in the "low" one. The low range you might further reduce by anchoring out and using less fuel, eating simple with no eating out, no insurance etc. to get to the $500-700 range. Some do with less even.
It is not a princely lifestyle but do-able and you can have a lot fun and satisfaction along the way, under sail or on your bike.
The biggest killers imho are medical and insurance. In the US the whole medical system is a jobs-mill. Instead of fighting disease it fights claims and lawsuits. Without insurance and big pharma involved health costs would be quite reasonable, as in many other countries.
Never mind that our wacko lifestyles create a whole new range of ills, from diabetes and lack of exercise to unhealthy food and PTSD. Can't wait to hear about the future health cost implications from Iphone addictions. Both mental and physical.
Floating armchair? Plenty of under-water houses to choose here too, LLamedos. Many come furnished too.
Ivo s/v Linnupesa and with bicycle.
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08-26-2012, 06:22 PM
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#25
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Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
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Hi guys,
This thread is by-and-large about making money while underway. While saving money and living cheaply is, by-and-large, the way that cruisers manage to extend their cruising--I'd like us to be focused about suggesting ways to (legally and ethically) make money while living a cruising life. Waiting until one is eligible for a pension, for example, doesn't work for a fellow who's 30 years old, ya know?
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08-26-2012, 09:31 PM
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#26
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Commander
Join Date: Apr 2008
Home Port: Edinburgh
Posts: 189
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Good Point Brenda,
Here is items that we are looking at as options for income:
1) Myself practicing part time or doing locums where I am able (I hold a Doctorate in Chiropractic and have experience in Sports sciences/medicine).
2) My wife has skills with fabric work from lace and ribbon to working with canvas (which I can help with the heavy fabrics as once own a business making tents).
3)She has experience in working with CSS and three of the modern shopping cart systems for websites and knows what is required to meet EU regulations for those wishing to do business there.
4) We have both done translation work from Italian to English.
5) We are both musicians (she is much more skilled then I) and can play at a public performance levels. She knows how to teach folks.
6) I have experience in wood working, carpentry/masonry skills (thanks USAR) and own and know how to run a CNC gantry router as well as other CNC machinery.
7) My wife can strip an engine down to its bare parts and rebuild it by herself (diesels are her preferred type as she grew up with a father who worked on Detroit, Cummings, Doitz, and S&S gensets (the big ones).
8) We both have graphic Art back ground though from different sides of the coin. She is the computer wiz at it and I can write in 9 different calligraphic hands as well as draw and other such.
This plus investments that we have and are making will cover most our costs while sailing. The Gantry router I own is one meter long by 700mm wide by 750mm tall and can be completely taken down as it is fully indexed and is capable of cutting steel. I currently make musical instrument parts with it.
We plan on adding further skill sets to this as we are preparing to go and the kids are taking to music well so we will see how things on that front (oldest may be competing in the UK this year in chromatic harmonica).
We have gotten very good at cooking and are accused by family and friends of living a caviar lifestyle on shoestring budget. It really depends on what you have and how you look at it. We both consider work a valuable part of life as it is taking ones skills/talents/gifts and using them; which is what they are meant for to begin with.
Michael
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What you see in the Universe, sees you.
MM6WMU
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08-27-2012, 02:56 AM
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#27
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Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
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Michael,
That's a great list of skills which can help you keep the dips into the kitty down--and allow you to do a range of enjoyable things whilst you travel!
I like it. How old are the kids?
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08-27-2012, 01:56 PM
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#28
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Ensign
Join Date: Aug 2012
Home Port: buenos aires
Posts: 11
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Well, a lot of responses, much more than my expectations, thanks!
Unfortunately we are not from USA. As says redbopeep we`r from Argentina, here no profecional wins too much except to go into the business world. But that is far from what we want for our future.
In fact we want a simpler life, my family comes from traders and travelers. Until we have a saying "We will always survive"
Systems engineer is referred to a long career of six years studies at the National University. So it's true that my professional knowledge can be economically profitable. But for now I want another experience. Developing more practical skills that allow us to be out of the system. Is this possible? well here we go with the experiment. We can always go back to start all over again.
Expectations? Hot food, nature, smile on face, good lessons for my son, new good friends. adventures? is all we want. We do not attract the luxuries, the material does not interest us.
Going over the details. I tell my calculations. U $ s 400 each for feeding and maintenance and $ 400 more for the boat. A total of $ 1,500 for the entire monthly budget. Although I hope to lower it a bit, but to be outside.
And I have a cost not very clear. The sails, takes about 4 to 5 years if proper care?
I read your comments very gratefully.
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08-27-2012, 05:43 PM
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#29
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Rear Admiral
Join Date: Dec 2008
Home Port: San Jose, CA
Vessel Name: Coyote
Posts: 215
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I didn't catch that "Argentina" part. What you call "Systems Engineer" might draw a very good income in the SF Bay area on a contract basis, but being from Argentina, work permit might prove a difficulty.
OTOH, I can tell you from experience that if you can solve a problem and aren't looking for official full time work, nobody really checks your credentials all that carefully as long as you can do what it is you say you can do. The pay can be shockingly large, though the cost of living is stunning, too.
In 25 years, nobody has ever asked to see my degree or for any proof that I actually earned it.
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: San Diego
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08-27-2012, 08:36 PM
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#30
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Commander
Join Date: Apr 2008
Home Port: Edinburgh
Posts: 189
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Brenda,
They are eight, five, three yrs old and youngest is 11 months.
Michael
__________________
What you see in the Universe, sees you.
MM6WMU
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08-27-2012, 09:02 PM
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#31
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Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chiroeurope
Brenda,
They are eight, five, three yrs old and youngest is 11 months.
Michael
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Oh, I want to share an anchorage with your family! Do you have pics? Can we see?
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08-27-2012, 09:08 PM
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#32
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Rear Admiral
Join Date: Dec 2008
Home Port: San Jose, CA
Vessel Name: Coyote
Posts: 215
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There are first-world jobs and lifestyles and there are cheap jobs and lifestyles. The big magic trick is to live a nice but simple low cost lifestyle and still earn like a professional in a real city.
As I said earlier, the money an engineer in Silicon Valley can easily make is astounding and a few months of pay will support a very nice cruising lifestyle for a year. If you can make 5K a week for a couple months and somehow manage not to spend it while you earn it, you have a lot of options.
An anchorage or beach hut in Mexico is a nice lifestyle and costs almost nothing. $1000/month offers some small luxury and a lot of good food. I've been happy there on less.
The trick is that the two are disjointed. You absolutely cannot live cheap in Silicon Valley, Tokyo, New York, London, etc. They are just different worlds. Anyone who can somehow manage to work in one world and live in the other has an advantage.
I remember living in San Diego and knowing a couple men who lived in Mexico and worked in San Diego. Cost: A couple hours a day of border crossing and this was before 9/11. Benefit: A beach house for $600 a month.
Living in big money society also gives pressure to live the lifestyle. $100 dinners and fancy cars and huge rent, etc. I see a lot of guys making good money and spending every dime or more.
Still, I know it can be done. If you establish the relationships where you can return for brief periods to work and live cheap while there, you might be able to do it. I know a world traveler who lives very well on $900/month and sometimes comes back for a few weeks at a time when an old friend needs a job done. He has to take it as it comes, though.
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: San Diego
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08-27-2012, 09:51 PM
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#33
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Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
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The trick is that the two are disjointed. You absolutely cannot live cheap in Silicon Valley, Tokyo, New York, London, etc. They are just different worlds. Anyone who can somehow manage to work in one world and live in the other has an advantage.
I dunno. We don't happen to work in Silicon Valley (contract work elsewhere is more lucrative and interesting for us at the time) but even so at present we live aboard the boat in Redwood City. $250/mo liveaboard fee, $10/ft slip $0.12/KWhr used (been about $15-$25/mo on the electric). Free wi-fi. Cheap mobile phone. Walking distance to public transportation/Caltrain, biking distance to many jobs in Silicon Valley (Palo Alto 8 mi, Sunnyvale 16 miles). We seldom drive but when we do we drive an old, old car that costs us about $250/mo when we add up the insurance/repairs/gas. There are 6 grocers within walking distance and many more further away. Some of them very inexpensive, some not. We don't eat out all that much--the food, cleaning supplies, catfood, and drink costs are mostly from eating at home and come in from $450/mo for a low month to $700/mo when we're entertaining/eatingout or contributing to potlucks alot.
There are marinas further away where one could live for less, but the transportation costs to get to the Silicon Valley area would eat up the savings.
So--think about it, living aboard your cruising boat in one of the best spots to make high wages in the USA, and one of the best sailing locations on the US west coast, an average cruising couple with an average 40' boat could make do on less than about $1500/mo including food and transport. Sure that wouldn't include clothing or medical or other things that we all have to deal with, but even so, it's pretty inexpensive.
One could travel up and down the west coast of North America making a stop here for a bit of money making...for a long time...
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08-27-2012, 10:33 PM
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#34
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Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
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We prefer the idea of traveling and making money where ever we may be to working in a fixed location. It seems that the world is pretty full of good "fixed locations" to work though if folks aren't keen upon starting a business and taking off on their own. Here's what work looks like Things Trudge Along - Startup Anywhere | Startup Anywhere from aboard our boat.
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08-27-2012, 11:50 PM
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#35
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Rear Admiral
Join Date: Dec 2008
Home Port: San Jose, CA
Vessel Name: Coyote
Posts: 215
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Wow, peep. You do really well. And I agree there is a lot of great cruising right here. I can't leave for a while because of my progeny. I'd love to take off to Mexico or points south, but as long as I'm stuck here and stuck living in a house and working for a living, things are much better than they could be. At least it isn't Missouri. I get lots of opportunities to cruise in California.
When the time comes I can abandon a house entirely, though, I will be looking for places cheaper and warmer.
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08-28-2012, 01:30 PM
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#36
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GOF
Join Date: Mar 2010
Home Port: MoreThe Abrolhos Islands
Vessel Name: Eleuthera
Posts: 128
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There is also the option of being in the right place at the right time. A lot of coastal towns in seasonal tourist area's need fill in staff during tourist season. This is more a tradie's paradise than management but works for Di and I. You still get to live on your boat, Sail away on weekends and move on when and if it suits you.
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08-28-2012, 03:33 PM
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#37
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Rear Admiral
Join Date: Dec 2008
Home Port: San Jose, CA
Vessel Name: Coyote
Posts: 215
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Good point. Also, where you have, say Americans or Canadians living in Mexico or other Spanish speaking countries, there is a need for things such as massage therapists, hair stylists, etc. who speak English and have an American sense of punctuality and service. I've seen lots of American communities where the people, or at least some fraction of them, are willing to pay for service they are more comfortable with.
Same with building skills. You can get people to do work for very little in Mexico, but a man who knows how to make windows and roofs not leak, can make a toilet flush every time without problem, can make a cement foundation that won't crack or slip can make a living. This is especially available for Mexicans who have lived and worked in the US for a couple decades, speak perfect English as well as Spanish, and really understand their trades.
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: San Diego
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08-28-2012, 07:47 PM
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#38
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Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
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Skills are key. We know a fellow who took is boat into a Mexican yard to do a complete rebuild (on his own) and he ended up installing electronics for the yard into many other boats--for about 1.5 years while he was working on his own boat. It was a great situation. Those types of opportunities pop up and you just have to "go with it" so to speak.
Fair winds,
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08-28-2012, 08:36 PM
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#39
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Commander
Join Date: Apr 2008
Home Port: Edinburgh
Posts: 189
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I know of three fellow Chiropractors who on a fluke went and did work in a place they wanted to visit and thought doing a part time locum would be a nice way to offset the costs of going. None of them have returned long term to the US. It really has to do with what you consider the good life. I am looking forward to the possibility of moving back to Italy and practicing while Sarah my wife gets her degree in music education. Most likely will be living on a boat while we are there as it is the cheapest way to live in that part of Italy (does require a bit of a commute to school for her but we are seriously looking into it).
Michael
__________________
What you see in the Universe, sees you.
MM6WMU
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08-29-2012, 01:48 PM
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#40
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Ensign
Join Date: Aug 2012
Home Port: buenos aires
Posts: 11
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I tell you I've been deeper into the various options for my family. Mainly we try to focus on getting options that allow us to develop the dentists for her.
Brazil is still a very attractive option for us. It is relatively easy for us to get work in the Mercosur countries, because trade agreements.
Then we could sail a time when we need to get some money for a few months radicarnos the coast of brazil windy. But far from these is dificl to predict. With the trends that you have shown us we are hopeful that we can adapt to exploit any opportunities along the way.
Well, I can not avoid, I am a very optimistic person
And now I have to open many more topics. But first I'm going to read more on the old forum. I leave a list:
Size, material and model boat
where to Buy
Equipment
Safety measures
best routes
etc
etc
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