Go Back   Cruiser Log World Cruising & Sailing Forums > Cruising Forums > The Bosun's Locker > Power & Electronics
Cruiser Wiki Click Here to Login

Join Cruiser Log Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 01-05-2011, 08:25 AM   #21
Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Home Port: Gisborne
Vessel Name: Balaena Bay
Posts: 88
Default

Hi Jim, yeh pirates all over the place here in new zealand, trouble is they are all employed by the government! I'm just quoting what they told me when we tried to persue the ship for damages and blame. I let off a Spot but it didn't get to the bunker in the States till later. The ship was 40 nm away by that time, but the only ship in the area!

You can turn the "send" part of these devices off if you don't want anyone to know you are going by. I think its great tech , in bad visibility being able to locate ships would certainly make me feel more comfortable. I am not that experienced with radar but from researching I believe they can let one down when the weather is nasty.

I was using Seaclear and the charts I'd callibrated myself but mostly as a backup to paper charts. I guess in a courtroom my navigation skills would be decimated by a good lawyer. Having very little qualifications in that area. If I had an AIS transponder they would have on record my track and the ships. Being an independent source I guess the info would have more clout in the courtroom. I guess also that these ais devices could be used against a yacht also, say one is motoring directly into the wind when a collision occurs so its definitely a two edged sword.
__________________

__________________
danblu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2011, 09:29 PM   #22
Ensign
 
multihullsailor6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 38
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nausikaa View Post

Extract from Reg. 1224/2009

Automatic identification system


1. In accordance with Annex II Part I point 3 of the Directive2002/59/EC, a fishing vessel exceeding 15 metres’ length overall shall be fitted with and maintain in operation an automatic identification system which meets the performance standards drawnup by the International Maritime Organisation according to chapter V, Regulation 19, section 2.4.5 of the 1974 SOLAS Convention.

2. Paragraph 1 shall apply:

A. as from 31 May 2014 to Community fishing vessels of15 metres’ length overall or more and less than 18 metres’length overall;

B. as from 31 May 2013 to Community fishing vessels of18 metres’ length overall or more and less than 24 metres’length overall;

C. as from 31 May 2012 to Community fishing vessels of24 metres’ length overall or more and less than 45 metres’length overall.
Hi Stephen,

Thanks for that info, though I am a bit unsure about the above length definitions! I take it that is the min and "more or less" max size.

As an "anedote" I was 25M off the Portguese coast sailing at the breath-taking speed of 2kts in daylight when, after checking around visually and seeing no other vessel and no other vessel being shown on my AIS I decided I could take a 45 minutes nap. So I set my alarm clock accordingly and put my head down for a well earned rest. When I woke up 45 min later I was approx. 200m away from a largish (say 25m) fishing vessel - still have NO clue where he came from! So it will be good (at least for me and my AIS) that even fishing vessels soon need to have to display their AIS position.
__________________

__________________
multihullsailor6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2011, 04:42 AM   #23
Moderator
 
redbopeep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by multihullsailor6 View Post

Hi Stephen,

Thanks for that info, though I am a bit unsure about the above length definitions! I take it that is the min and "more or less" max size.

As an "anedote" I was 25M off the Portguese coast sailing at the breath-taking speed of 2kts in daylight when, after checking around visually and seeing no other vessel and no other vessel being shown on my AIS I decided I could take a 45 minutes nap. So I set my alarm clock accordingly and put my head down for a well earned rest. When I woke up 45 min later I was approx. 200m away from a largish (say 25m) fishing vessel - still have NO clue where he came from! So it will be good (at least for me and my AIS) that even fishing vessels soon need to have to display their AIS position.
It sounds like it would be a good idea for you to have an AIS transponder aboard to warn other vessels of your existence since you're not keeping a lookout. Sadly, it is not possible to properly keep watch while solo sailing unless you anchor for your crew rest. Even if hove-to, I can't imagine how a solo sailor gets a wink of sleep out there.
__________________
"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda

What we're doing - The sailing life aboard and the Schooner Chandlery.

redbopeep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2011, 07:40 AM   #24
Admiral
 
Nausikaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,619
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbopeep View Post

Sadly, it is not possible to properly keep watch while solo sailing unless you anchor for your crew rest.
That, of course, is the dilemma of solo-sailing. There is no way one can follow the rules and sail solo for longer than 18 hours or so.

Regarding multihullsailorg's comments; I agree that the wording is far from perfect but it is cut and pasted from the regulation. You are quite right in your interpretation as the regulation is referring to vessels between the lengths of XX and YY.

Incidentally, and as another anecdote about the Portuguese coast, years ago, it must have been in the mid 1970's, I was on watch as 3rd officer on a ship on passage to Haifa from a northern European port. We were heading southwards off the Portuguese coast. The weather was fine and clear but windy - about force 6. On watch, apart from myself, was an able seaman as lookout and another on stand-by to take the helm if we needed to go to hand-steering. In other words, a well manned bridge in accordance with and, in fact, exceeding the required standards. One of the two bridge radars was in operation and the other on stand-by.

I had taken and worked out my morning sights, calculated the time of noon and was also keeping a look-out. I should add that I always did keep a look-out myself as it was my ticket on the line if anything went wrong, not the seaman's on look-out duties. When working out sights I would do a couple of calculation lines and then look around the horizon before returning to my sight-book. At the time of the incident I was doing nothing else but keeping a look-out and monitoring the vessels course. Suddenly, not 100 metres away, I spot a small, fishing boat. Fortunately, the boat was passing clear down our port side but it could have been a very different scenario.

Why did two pairs of eyes, mine and the able seaman's, not spot the boat earlier? The answer is simple, and this was a lesson for life for me, the boat was small, about 35 feet loa, and painted white. With wave crests breaking everywhere and the low height of the vessel, she was impossible to see at any distance.

Since that occurrence, I have been absolutely convinced that yachts need to do everything possible to be visible. What helps? My suggestions are:

1. Paint your boat in a bright colour but not white

2. Have coloured sails or, at least, a coloured band on your sail above the normal reefing levels. A bright coloured dodger and spray-hood also helps.

3. Carry the correct lights at night (I would also encourage the use of a strobe but that is contrary to the ColRegs)

4. Have a radar reflector rigged and, preferably, also have an active radar transponder

5. Have an AIS transponder and keep it switched on (except in pirate infested waters)

At sea, be seen to be safe!

Aye // Stephen
__________________
Yacht NAUSIKAA | Call Sign: 2AJH2




WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU DID SOMETHING FOR THE FIRST TIME?

www.nausikaa.org.uk

= Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Lithuania
Nausikaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2011, 09:07 PM   #25
Ensign
 
multihullsailor6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 38
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nausikaa View Post

Since that occurrence, I have been absolutely convinced that yachts need to do everything possible to be visible. What helps? My suggestions are:

1. Paint your boat in a bright colour but not white

2. Have coloured sails or, at least, a coloured band on your sail above the normal reefing levels. A bright coloured dodger and spray-hood also helps.

3. Carry the correct lights at night (I would also encourage the use of a strobe but that is contrary to the ColRegs)

4. Have a radar reflector rigged and, preferably, also have an active radar transponder

5. Have an AIS transponder and keep it switched on (except in pirate infested waters)

At sea, be seen to be safe!

Aye // Stephen
Stephen,

To be seen at sea by anyone - not only the big boys IF they are watching - is imperative for us sailors. All of your above 5 points are correct.

As to

points 1 and 2: I am planning to add "refective orange" to top third of my mast and well as my cabin top and, at a later stage, to my mainsail.

point 3: Equip your boat with LED navigational lights, apart from the better power drain aspect they seem to be brighter. There are also the 3M LED lights available.

I was told by an ex-merchant captain now sailor that a strobe light is now acceptable for offshore sailing according to newest COLREGS. Mine's installed but does not want to work and the replacement is not installed yet!!

point 4: Go for the best permanantly installed radar reflector, the Tri-Lens. Especially the "tube" type is useless, a sinking trimaran off Namibia saw the big container ship long before they picked him up on radar and had to VHF-talk his rescuers to him!

And if you go the active radar transponer route spend a little more and have a dual X and S band unit.

point 5: Yes, like me!

Regards from winter- warm (19*C) Gibraltar

Roger
__________________
multihullsailor6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2011, 07:17 AM   #26
Admiral
 
Nausikaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,619
Default

Roger,

Well done for making your craft as visible as possible!

A quirk of fate that we both are in the same part of the world, so I am pleased to hear of the balmy weather at the other end of the Iberian peninsula. Here, in Galacia, we are experiencing usual winter weather for the area, i.e. cool and wet, wet, wet and wet!

Another quirk of fate is that you mention Namibia, where I used to live albeit in Windhoek and not on the coast. I have, however, sailed a lot in merchant ships as well as fisheries protection vessels in that area and am not surprised to hear of the trimaran / container-ship issue as major refraction can occur in there at some times of year. I remember once, approaching from the north, seeing Cape Columbine light and hearing Cape Town Radio, based at Milnerton, when still some 200 NM from the Cape. Light is a form of electro-magnetic wave as are radar and radio signals thus radar and radio is influenced in a similar way. In radar speak, this is called super-refraction, trapping or ducting.

Super-Refractionis a result of the vertical distributions of temperature, moisture, and pressure causing the radar waves to bend more toward the surface of Earth than under normal conditions. As the refractivity gradient continues to decrease, the wave path’s curve will approach the radius of curvature of the earth. Such conditions can extend radar coverage up to 50% above normal.

Trapping occurs when the radius of curvature for the wave becomes smaller than Earth’s. Waves may then become trapped between two, i.e. the Earth’s surface and the negative gradient causing the downward refraction.

Trapping produces the greatest extremes in radar performance and can significantly extend radar ranges. Radar waves refracting sharply downwards, then reflecting off of Earth’s surface, may travel distances well beyond normal. Trapping can occur between the surface and an overlying region of the atmosphere with faster speed characteristics. It can also occur between two layers of the atmosphere that have different characteristics. This is known as an elevated duct.

Trapping is caused by strong low level inversions (temperature increases with height). It can also occur when a strong cap (EML) of warm and dry air exists in the lower troposphere above very moist air. When this happens it causes the radar to be able to detect objects at much further distances than normal. However, it also increases ground clutter as the radar beam remains closer to the earth's surface for a greater distance and can even bend into the earth's surface. It is more common in the morning hours since this time of the day experiences the strongest low-level inversions due to cooling of earth's surface through longwave radiation emission.

The disadvantages of trapping is the increase of ground clutter and increased anomalous propagation which can result in a small target disappearing in the clutter. This may have been the case when the container vessel failed to observe the yacht on their radar.

I agree completely regarding the radar transponder - go for the dual band type. No question about it!

With respect to LED lights, the important issue is that they should be approved by an appropriate body. I have, however, heard that they dim with time so keep an eye on them to ensure they continue to function at maximum brightness.

I have not heard anything about new COLREGS coming into force but the current ones certainly do not permit strobe lights. I would welcome a rethink on this issue by IMO but the current situation is well described in rule 36....

Quote:

If necessary to attract the attention of another vessel, any vessel may make light or sound signals that cannot be mistaken for any signal authorized elsewhere in these Rules, or may direct the beam of her searchlight in the direction of the danger, in such a way as not to embarrass any vessel Any light to attract the attention of another vessel shall be such that it cannot be mistaken for any aid to navigation. For the purpose of this Rule the use of high intensity intermittent or revolving lights, such as strobe lights, shall be avoided.
All the above is a little off the AIS topic but, I believe, important and thereby warranted.

Aye // Stephen
__________________
Yacht NAUSIKAA | Call Sign: 2AJH2




WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU DID SOMETHING FOR THE FIRST TIME?

www.nausikaa.org.uk

= Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Lithuania
Nausikaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2011, 09:25 AM   #27
Admiral
 
MMNETSEA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,067
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nausikaa View Post

Since that occurrence, I have been absolutely convinced that yachts need to do everything possible to be visible. What helps? My suggestions are:

1. Paint your boat in a bright colour but not white

2. Have coloured sails or, at least, a coloured band on your sail above the normal reefing levels. A bright coloured dodger and spray-hood also helps.

3. Carry the correct lights at night (I would also encourage the use of a strobe but that is contrary to the ColRegs)

4. Have a radar reflector rigged and, preferably, also have an active radar transponder

5. Have an AIS transponder and keep it switched on (except in pirate infested waters)

At sea, be seen to be safe!

Aye // Stephen
Hi Stephen,

Absolutely spot on! Could not agree more! Returning a MacIntosh 47 to Hong Kong from the Philippines after the South China Sea Race - still a 100 odd NM to go in very bad weather, big seas, alone at the helm, most of the crew laid low and sick. Radar not functioning - steaming light on, together with mast top tri-light. Motor-sailing with one reef in the main. Visibility maybe 1/4 mile - then ran into Hong Kong's fishing fleet - linked in pairs running parallel trawling a single net. I never saw the first two until they fired a flare! Obviously they had seen me and decided I should be warned. I had enough time to turn and avoid being trapped.

Richard
__________________
MMNETSEA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2011, 08:37 PM   #28
Ensign
 
multihullsailor6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 38
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MMNETSEA View Post

Hi Stephen,

Absolutely spot on! Could not agree more! Returning a MacIntosh 47 to Hong Kong from the Philippines after the South China Sea Race - still a 100 odd NM to go in very bad weather, big seas, alone at the helm, most of the crew laid low and sick. Radar not functioning - steaming light on, together with mast top tri-light. Motor-sailing with one reef in the main. Visibility maybe 1/4 mile - then ran into Hong Kong's fishing fleet - linked in pairs running parallel trawling a single net. I never saw the first two until they fired a flare! Obviously they had seen me and decided I should be warned. I had enough time to turn and avoid being trapped.

Richard
That situation report (which is quite scary but well known) reminds me that, though I do have an AIS transceiver but no radar on board, I also have an oldish Lo-Kata Watchman installed which is supposed to warn me when hit by a radar transmission after which you can take part of the unit on deck and find the direction of the radar source. Great for off-shore but not much use in coastal sailing with many fishing boats or close to a shipping highway. The French have a modern version available called "Mer Veille" which is also available in the United States called .........? which indicates the quarter on which the radar beam was received. Met a French single handed sailor who was very happy with his French unit. Anybody have experience with such a radar warner?
__________________
multihullsailor6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2011, 06:20 PM   #29
Moderator
 
JeanneP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,098
Default

We had such a radar detector, bought a year or two after we first set off cruising, then bought another, newer version when it became available. It was developed by a cruiser, though I believe he sold it to another company. We swore by it, particularly since we never had radar, and it worked very well. Called C.A.R.D system, we found it through a sailing magazine ad.

Here's a description of it, C.A.R.D. radar detector

Here's another discussion of it on Cruiserlog: http://www.cruiserlog.com/forums/ind...showtopic=2742
__________________
In 1986 we went cruising for a few years. After 20 years and 50+ countries and several oceans, we are STILL "cruising for a few years".

SY WATERMELON |
MV WATERMELON (New) | Cruiser's Dictionary, free ebook

= Cruiser's Dictionary, North America,
JeanneP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2011, 06:34 PM   #30
Moderator
 
redbopeep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Home Port: Washington DC
Vessel Name: SV Mahdee
Posts: 3,236
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by name='multihullsailor6' timestamp='1294432649' post='45987

That situation report (which is quite scary but well known) reminds me that, though I do have an AIS transceiver but no radar on board, I also have an oldish Lo-Kata Watchman installed which is supposed to warn me when hit by a radar transmission after which you can take part of the unit on deck and find the direction of the radar source. Great for off-shore but not much use in coastal sailing with many fishing boats or close to a shipping highway. The French have a modern version available called "Mer Veille" which is also available in the United States called .........? which indicates the quarter on which the radar beam was received. Met a French single handed sailor who was very happy with his French unit. Anybody have experience with such a radar warner?
Reaching far from our initial topic, but interesting none-the-less, back in the mid-1980's when hubby was flying F14's for the USN, the squadron he was part of were frustrated by certain aspects of their own ability to detect another plane when in air combat maneuver (ACM) exercises and while performing their duties in the Middle East off Iran (gee, things haven't changed much in a quarter century...); the pilots used cheapy Radio Shack or Cobra type radar detectors for better detection of other planes nearby than their own (very costly) radar systems were able to detect. Some of it related to the fact that during these exercises, the planes would use chaff ( a mid-air release of a radar reflecting substance that would confuse radar looking for targets) but I don't recall the other issues. All in all, I just recall hubby thinking automotive radar detectors were great in non-automotive use.

We do not have a radar detector at this time, only AIS. We also don't have radar right now either. The only times we miss radar is when we want to know what's happening with nearby storm systems--not when we are wondering about other traffic.
__________________
"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda

What we're doing - The sailing life aboard and the Schooner Chandlery.

redbopeep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2011, 11:47 AM   #31
Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Home Port: Gisborne
Vessel Name: Balaena Bay
Posts: 88
Default

I've been looking at these Vesper Marine transponders and i'm impressed by t he feedback they have received. Seems they have programming that filters unneeded signals which clears the screen. Probably not so important around here (gisborne, nz) but vital in busy seaways. Here's a link....http://www.vespermarine.co.nz/marine...nsponder.html/ . The filtering seems to be the obvious difference between the more basic and the dearer devices.

Does the Simrad AI 50 AIS transceiver have the same type of filtering?

Also the feedback on the Vesper marine site indicates these are really worthwhile to have aboard. For shorthanded sailing how neat to be able to see immediately where ships are and what they are going to do. I guess these are fairly new so prices will probably come down and new features may be included.

I'm thinking also that a receiver is probably enough. Seems from the Vesper feedback that ships are quite courteous when hailed and give way like country gentlemen. We have to keep a lookout all the time regardless and these have alarms so really can't see much advantage in having a transponder. Panbo site has a blurb about ships turning filtering on so as to only show shipping when in high traffic areas. They may not do so but I believe they can.
__________________
danblu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2011, 06:45 PM   #32
Ensign
 
multihullsailor6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 38
Default

On my Simrad AI50 I do have a customable CPA alarm system. The range I select depends on where I sail, ie the traffic, the time of day / night, the weather / visibility and the no. of crew on board. When I singlehand the selected range is larger than when I am with crew.

I am not sure how the Vesper "filters" the traffic, from the picture on their website there is a screen which will show the AIS positions relative to your own. Not sure if as a pure receiver it is worth the extra money compared to the NASA AIS Radar.

As to having a transceiver or just a receiver - with my transceiver at least I know I am making myself as electronically visible as possible, if the big ships don't look at their screen / printout or turn it off, well there is nothing I can do about that but have MY alarm on!
__________________
multihullsailor6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 04:19 AM   #33
Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Home Port: Gisborne
Vessel Name: Balaena Bay
Posts: 88
Default

Yes Multihullsailor,

Transceiver would be nice to have no doubt. If a ship triggers your alarm, as mentioned, you would call on the vhf and ask if they see you and what intentions they have. To my thinking this is not different in practice than just having a receiver though I'm sure the added security of having your presence going out is reassuring' especially with more leisure craft having Ais receivers. I have read of skippers getting too many ships on their Nasa ais receivers in some places. I can imagine that would increase tension with alarms going off frequently even if the ship has passed. I'm happy to be corrected on these points if someone thinks differently. I'm here to learn! Also, in our area there is not any private monitoring of AIS signals so they don't show up on the website. Kept an eye on Gisborne Harbour and the website and we have had ships in that don't appear on the website. Skippers seem to be very happy with AIS (some) even suggesting that its more useful than radar.
__________________
danblu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 08:20 AM   #34
Rear Admiral
 
Silver Raven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 218
Default

[QUOTE=danblu;1295237983]

Yes Multihullsailor,

Transceiver would be nice to have no doubt. If a ship triggers your alarm, as mentioned, you would call on the vhf and ask if they see you and what intentions they have. To my thinking this is not different in practice than just having a receiver though I'm sure the added security of having your presence going out is reassuring' especially with more leisure craft having Ais receivers. I have read of skippers getting too many ships on their Nasa ais receivers in some places. I can imagine that would increase tension with alarms going off frequently even if the ship has passed. I'm happy to be corrected on these points if someone thinks differently. I'm here to learn! Also, in our area there is not any private monitoring of AIS signals so they don't show up on the website. Kept an eye on Gisborne Harbour and the website and we have had ships in that don't appear on the website. Skippers seem to be very happy with AIS (some) even suggesting that its more useful than radar.

G'day Peter. 'Silver Raven here. Just across the 'puddle'. Check out my 'profile' - I did yours. What's your life worth? Mine's worth 10's of millions (& that's in PURE gold) - at least to me. Serious suggestion is that you re-read this whole topic from top to bottom !!! Mico, MMNETSEA & multi6 have very clearly indicated that the use of the 'whole system' has saved their lives. I'm in agreement with all of this. BIG TIME I've been racing (wash my mouth out with "Gramma's lie-sol') eg. off Newcastle NSW, Australia in a total 'white-out' with 6 going out & 4 coming in - all coal carriers 'super tankers' - all doing 20 plus knots, could not be seen (1978 - before AIS). Think about that - a living horror story - in our very face & IN the dark. I would very seriously - IMHO - ask you to re think your evaluation. I would/am going to 'get the works', & at the highest level, just to increase my chances of staying alive. Suggest you do the same. We, all here, are not wanting to go to anyone's wake. #1/ They have to see you; #2/ You have to be able to let them know - - you see them - - it is on official record, #3/ you both need to know what the other is doing. It WILL save your life. Sure do hope you re-read all the above posts & make the - over safe - decision. Good sailing & do try to 'stay-with-us, Please. Ciao from - across-the-puddle, james. Dollars don't - - life does !!!!!!!!!!!! jj
__________________
Silver Raven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 10:42 AM   #35
Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Home Port: Gisborne
Vessel Name: Balaena Bay
Posts: 88
Default

Haa haa, sure James , what is exactly your point. Yo've obviously survived this long sailing without AIS and it sounds like in rather difficult areas. I'm just trying to get my head around the pro's and con's of these various systems before we lash out and buy. By the time we are ready to go cruising the tech may have been upgraded considerable so I'd like to know as much as possible about these devices. I don't need AIS to sail about the bay here. If your after the "works" you'll be paying about as much as your life is worth (ha ha)as some of these systems are way expensive. i can't afford an $7000 AIS transponder. Its useful to discuss these devices as its new tech and its actually fairly difficult to get critical information about them. For example, the clutter situation with some systems isn't well described by the advertising literature except for the Vesper Marine devices. The way I see it...

Basic receiver........usually outputs nmea 0183, no filtering, don't know whether the range is adjustable.

Standard Horizen vhf with AIs.....much the same as the above. I like the idea of this and it's got great vhf features.

Vesper Marine.... filters irrelevent data both receiver and transponder.

Simrad Transponder.... range filtering. and a thumbs up from multihullsailer.

Let alone the range these devices receive from.

Any way Silver Raven hope you guys are all good there in Newcastle and that cyclone going past is not giving you trouble. I used to live in Wingham so I know the area well, beautiful place. I'm a misplaced Aussie who's planning on sailing home some time soon.
__________________
danblu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 02:43 PM   #36
Moderator
 
JeanneP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,098
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbopeep View Post

I would doubt that any government safety body (CG et al) would want to see yachtsmen making lawsuits and claims based upon AIS (a safety navigation system) information.
I think that New Zealand is latching onto AIS as an aid to helping sailors in their waters keep saife, and perhaps get justice for accidents/damage.

Back in 1996/7 the cruising community was abuzz with the story of the terrible loss of most of the Sleavin family, sailing to New Zealand, who were hit by a freighter during bad weather. Here's a reasonably complete news report of the collision, Sinking of the Melinda Lee

There was a lot of effort later to investigate this event, and the cruising community was outraged at the apparent refusal of the S. Korean freighter to search for any survivors of the collision. Judith Sleavin said that she saw the freighter as she and her husband and daughter clung to the partially deflated dinghy in the water, and though the deck of the freighter was full of crewmen looking down at them, the freighter didn't make any effort to rescue them but just turned and disappeared into the storm.

I cannot imagine the horror and devastation this woman has suffered for the loss of her husband and two children. Although I believed then, and still believe, that there are many lessons for all cruisers to be learned from this tragedy, I cannot bring myself to start such a discussion.

I believe that the majority of mariners and ship captains understand not only the laws of the sea but the spirit of going to the aid of other mariners. I would hope that fear of retribution would not be the motivating factor in keeping watch.

But I would welcome any devices that can help keep us safe, and I think that AIS is one of those devices. I would not be surprised if countries other than NZ use monitoring of ships traffic for other purposes than just keeping a watch. I would think that in the US the Department of Homeland Security is using it for their purposes, and if not, I think that they should be.

Just my two cents.
__________________
In 1986 we went cruising for a few years. After 20 years and 50+ countries and several oceans, we are STILL "cruising for a few years".

SY WATERMELON |
MV WATERMELON (New) | Cruiser's Dictionary, free ebook

= Cruiser's Dictionary, North America,
JeanneP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 08:40 PM   #37
Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Home Port: Gisborne
Vessel Name: Balaena Bay
Posts: 88
Default

It was a logging ship like what collided with me I believe. To have hit that family and watched them from the rails and continuing on is inhuman. I would have mutinied if I were aboard her. Then not even reporting the incident to the coastguard!! Surely lowlife scum. Somethings seriously wrong with South Korean shipping. I know most shipping is crewed by honourable people who would be aghast at this type of action but surely there are some monsters out there. I guess their morality is the buck. How do they sleep. Too lazy to even alter course a few degrees or slow down. When they have the war their Kama's will catch up to them.

Maybe sinking yachts is sport for these monsters!!

The point that the crew did see the yachts lights but didn't turn or slow down indicates that they deliberately ran the yacht down.
__________________
danblu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 01:48 AM   #38
Rear Admiral
 
Silver Raven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 218
Default

[QUOTE=danblu;1295296833]

It was a logging ship like what collided with me I believe. To have hit that family and watched them from the rails and continuing on is inhuman. I would have mutinied if I were aboard her. Then not even reporting the incident to the coastguard!! Surely lowlife scum. Somethings seriously wrong with South Korean shipping. I know most shipping is crewed by honourable people who would be aghast at this type of action but surely there are some monsters out there. I guess their morality is the buck. How do they sleep. Too lazy to even alter course a few degrees or slow down. When they have the war their Kama's will catch up to them.

Maybe sinking yachts is sport for these monsters!!

The point that the crew did see the yachts lights but didn't turn or slow down indicates that they deliberately ran the yacht down.

G'day Peter -ex-pat Aussie. Re - ha ha, james. OOOPS I had not realized that they were THAT expensive, WOW. At a $1000/mo as some claim - by the time it's installed & working - that is 3/4's of a year of cruising funds. I couldn't/wouldn't wish to spend that either. There's just gotta be someone in these forums that can find a better cost/value AIS or something that works. A radar c/w alarms & all the whistles/buttons doesn't cost that much - I don't think. Blinken-heck - There I go again. WRONG. I have known & worked with & around Brian Swinton of Brian Swinton Marine Electronics for over 30 years here in Cairns, Qld & just phoned him for some rough costs. Wow - was I ever out-of-touch with current prices. Egg in my face & mud in my beard. You were correct - I was not. Here's some info - in general terms; Foruno - radar 2kw power - range 0 to 20 k- can't see through rain-squalls & bad weather nor usable when yacht is standing still - aprox $3ks (aussie $'s) - next - 6kw power model - 48 to 72 ks & can see through (tall buildings, in a single bound) - see through rain-squalls, bad weather & works 10/10 when stationary - aprox $6k (ouch) : : AIS Class A - receive only aprox $500, AIS Class B - receive & transmit - aprox $1500. SO I eat much humble-pie. You were right - modern electronics is a tad dear (not with antlers). However if it saves my life & my yacht I'm doing my shopping & will just have to live (very key word there) with the cost & weight - on my light-weight cruising multihull (& I may have lost all friendship - having said that) ha ha

Let us see what others have to say. Like the 'big roach' subject - much for all of us to learn here & I'm looking forward to that. Know a COUPLE OF K1W1's but can't find one of them. The other is David & Tatiana Barker (artist & multihull designer (Sundancer & Sundreamer) & they live in Kerikeri. Can't find Michael Orr though. Great guy & used to work for me repairing yachts & FRP work on the Cairns water front. Y'all over the puddle have a great day, ciao for now, james
__________________
Silver Raven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 07:44 AM   #39
Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Home Port: Gisborne
Vessel Name: Balaena Bay
Posts: 88
Default

Yes some of the AIS stuff is real dear but say the Standard Horizon VHF with AIS receiver is great value at roughly 500 bucks nz. Nasa Marine have a receiver thats great value at about 250 bucks nz. I've seen one from Furuno for 7000 bucks nz!! Must be huge difference in the features these have for that sort of a price difference. Probably as many K1W1's over where you are as here Ae James. Cheers Pete.
__________________

__________________
danblu is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ais Garmin Interfacing? Gallivanters Power & Electronics 2 01-11-2011 05:11 AM
Ais Compatability steelfan General Cruising Forum 8 03-07-2010 07:28 PM
Vhf Ais Reciever Rossmonty Power & Electronics 4 09-05-2009 08:58 AM
AIS YachtVALHALLA General Cruising Forum 17 01-20-2006 02:44 PM
AIS, Valhalla's Near Miss and Colregs AndrewF General Cruising Forum 2 01-12-2006 02:11 AM

Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

RV & Travel Trailer Communities

Our RV & Travel Trailer sites encompasses virtually all types of Recreational Vehicles, from brand-specific to general RV communities.

» More about our RV Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


All times are GMT. The time now is 04:25 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0
×